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Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

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Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#111
"How many bugs and wasted CPU cycles and instances of human frustration (not to mention bad design) have resulted from that one small shortcut about 40 years ago?"

Sigh, if only most of us had worked on a software system that has lasted as long as that.

Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#112
post #108
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I see no benefit. The first benefit is that it removes clutters from your $HOME. The second benefit is that you can now manage and backup your settings in a sane way. * ~/.config contains config files (should not be lost, but if lost you can recreate them); * ~/.local contains user data files (save them often, never lose them for they are not replaceable); * ~/.cache contains cached information (can be tmpfs mounte…

All of your points are invalid for a simple reason: Almost no software uses this fancy standard. And for the backup-case: Whitelisting is usually a futile idea to begin with. Normally you'd prefer to backup the odd superfluous file rather than miss an important one. Luckily most of the apps used on Linux systems now use it Excuse me? $ find ~ -maxdepth 1 -name ".*" | wc -l 228 $ find ~/.local | wc -l 4 $ uname Linux

I counter your anecdote with my anecdote:

  $ find ~ -maxdepth 1 -name '.*' | wc -l
  354
  $ find ~/.local/ -maxdepth 1 | wc -l
  3
  $ find ~/.local/share -maxdepth 1 | wc -l
  66
  $ find ~/.config/ -maxdepth 1 | wc -l
  108
  $ find ~/.cache/ -maxdepth 1 | wc -l
  803
  $ uname
  Linux
  $ lsb_release -d
  Description:	Ubuntu 12.04 LTS

Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#113
post #44

I really like it that G+ is becoming a "lightweight blogging" platform. There are too many of these around, and folding them into a "social network" seems like a good idea. I wish they would add more features that would make this easier, though, since in general I think it's in everyone's interest and will pull more traffic to the site.

A bit off topic, but is it just me or is the quality of comments on public G+ posts is absolutely terrible? Within a few hours there has been more than 100 replies. Most are inane, rude, of the useless “great post!” type, or just plain old spam. I could only manage to glean about 8 or 9 insightful replies.

Is this something intrinsic to G+? Is it a function of the author's popularity? The discussions here are normally much more sensible, but I would expect HN's readership to have a fairly similar demographic to that of Rob Pike's G+ subscribers.

Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#115
post #113
post #44

I really like it that G+ is becoming a "lightweight blogging" platform. There are too many of these around, and folding them into a "social network" seems like a good idea. I wish they would add more features that would make this easier, though, since in general I think it's in everyone's interest and will pull more traffic to the site.

A bit off topic, but is it just me or is the quality of comments on public G+ posts is absolutely terrible? Within a few hours there has been more than 100 replies. Most are inane, rude, of the useless “great post!” type, or just plain old spam. I could only manage to glean about 8 or 9 insightful replies. Is this something intrinsic to G+? Is it a function of the author's popularity? The discussions here are normall…

That was exactly my thought--there were a few thoughtful replies in there, but otherwise just absolute mindless bullshit. It's the same way when Linus makes a post about how he's just updated the code in his preferred emacs editor, spawning 500 posts of "I use Vim!"

Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#116
post #42

The main takeaway I think is that the reason we are doing things the way we do them is because that is how we have been doing them, not because of some kind of genius design. And actually the whole thing can start out as a mistake, and then later on basically becomes a religion. Its very funny actually.

Yes, very organic. The original programming shortcut accidentally created a sort of ecological niche, in which all sorts of things started to take root. Now, nobody can bulldoze the lot because there's too much stuff growing there.

Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#117
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It didn't use to work. I think it was added for XP SP2 or so, probably due to the popularity of manu *nix ports like Emacs.

It always did, at least in NTFS. What did not, and still does not, is to create them via Windows Explorer. You can create them just fine from the command line, or via Windows APIs.

You can create them in Windows Explorer with a little trick: type the name with a trailing dot. Entering ".vimrc." will save as ".vimrc", no trailing dot.

Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#118
post #108
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I see no benefit. The first benefit is that it removes clutters from your $HOME. The second benefit is that you can now manage and backup your settings in a sane way. * ~/.config contains config files (should not be lost, but if lost you can recreate them); * ~/.local contains user data files (save them often, never lose them for they are not replaceable); * ~/.cache contains cached information (can be tmpfs mounte…

All of your points are invalid for a simple reason: Almost no software uses this fancy standard. And for the backup-case: Whitelisting is usually a futile idea to begin with. Normally you'd prefer to backup the odd superfluous file rather than miss an important one. Luckily most of the apps used on Linux systems now use it Excuse me? $ find ~ -maxdepth 1 -name ".*" | wc -l 228 $ find ~/.local | wc -l 4 $ uname Linux

   % uname
   Linux
   % find ~/.local | wc -l
   16824
   % find ~ -maxdepth 1 -name ".*" | wc -l
   279

Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#119
post #113
post #44

I really like it that G+ is becoming a "lightweight blogging" platform. There are too many of these around, and folding them into a "social network" seems like a good idea. I wish they would add more features that would make this easier, though, since in general I think it's in everyone's interest and will pull more traffic to the site.

A bit off topic, but is it just me or is the quality of comments on public G+ posts is absolutely terrible? Within a few hours there has been more than 100 replies. Most are inane, rude, of the useless “great post!” type, or just plain old spam. I could only manage to glean about 8 or 9 insightful replies. Is this something intrinsic to G+? Is it a function of the author's popularity? The discussions here are normall…

G+ is fair to middlin' at a bunch of stuff. Comments lack threading. There's poor noise control. Content filtering is limited to "+1" or "flag". There's no "-1" button (though various Chrome extensions have offered this at various points.

The main advantage is that it's a large community (10m+ users presently) initially seeded by Googlers (e.g.: tech-savvy people), and including a few notable luminaries such as Rob Pike. And if you've got the right circles, eventually good content finds its way into your stream. Sometimes (content discover/surfacing is something G+ does surprisingly poorly, and is an area at whch HN, Reddit, and StackExchange win hugely).

Re: Rob Pike: the origin of dotfiles

#120
post #112
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of your points are invalid for a simple reason: Almost no software uses this fancy standard. And for the backup-case: Whitelisting is usually a futile idea to begin with. Normally you'd prefer to backup the odd superfluous file rather than miss an important one. Luckily most of the apps used on Linux systems now use it Excuse me? $ find ~ -maxdepth 1 -name ".*" | wc -l 228 $ find ~/.local | wc -l 4 $ uname Linux

I counter your anecdote with my anecdote: $ find ~ -maxdepth 1 -name '.*' | wc -l 354 $ find ~/.local/ -maxdepth 1 | wc -l 3 $ find ~/.local/share -maxdepth 1 | wc -l 66 $ find ~/.config/ -maxdepth 1 | wc -l 108 $ find ~/.cache/ -maxdepth 1 | wc -l 803 $ uname Linux $ lsb_release -d Description: Ubuntu 12.04 LTS

That's interesting, and sort of disturbing.

My box is not a desktop, so that's probably the difference. I still find that scheme an atrocity.

When going to that length they could at least have settled for one directory (~/.appdata or whatever). Half-baked is the most polite description I can come up with.

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