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21st Century C++

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Re: 21st Century C++

#111

Post by midnightclubbed »

erwincoumans wrote: post #105
imron wrote: post #94

I want to love C++. Over my career I’ve written hundreds of thousands of lines of it. But keeping up with it is time consuming and more and more I find myself reaching for other languages.

Same here. >>contemporary C++30 can express the ideas embodied in such old-style code far simpler IMO, newer C++ versions are becoming more complex (too many ways to do the same thing), less readable (prefer explicit types over 'auto', unless unavoidable) and harder to analyse performance and memory implications (hard to even track down what is happening under the hood). I wish the C++ language and standard library w…

I have used auto liberally for 8+ years; maybe I'm accustomed to reading code containing it but I really can't think of it being a problem. I feel like auto increases readability, the only thing I dislike is that they didnt make it a reference by default.

Where do you see difficult to track down performance/memory implications? Lambda comes to mind and maybe coroutines (yet to use them but guessing there may be some memory allocations under the hood). I like that I can breakpoint my C++ code and look at the disassembly if I am concerned that the compiler did something other than expected.

Re: 21st Century C++

#112

Post by ninkendo »

mindcrime wrote: post #109

I was an extreme C++ bigot back in the late 90's, early 2000's. My license plate back then was CPPHACKR[1]. But industry trends and other things took my career in the direction of favoring Java, and I've spent most of the last 20+ years thinking of myself as mainly a "Java guy". But I keep buying new C++ books and I always install the C++ tooling on any new box I build. I tell myself that "one day" I'm going to inves…

Funny, sounds like the Simpsons gag from the same time period: “what’s wrong with this country? Can’t a man walk down the street without being offered a job?”

https://youtube.com/watch?v=yDbvVFffWV4

Re: 21st Century C++

#113

Post by kylecazar »

mindcrime wrote: post #109

I was an extreme C++ bigot back in the late 90's, early 2000's. My license plate back then was CPPHACKR[1]. But industry trends and other things took my career in the direction of favoring Java, and I've spent most of the last 20+ years thinking of myself as mainly a "Java guy". But I keep buying new C++ books and I always install the C++ tooling on any new box I build. I tell myself that "one day" I'm going to inves…

AIEXPERT here I come!

Re: 21st Century C++

#114

Post by ttul »

mindcrime wrote: post #109

I was an extreme C++ bigot back in the late 90's, early 2000's. My license plate back then was CPPHACKR[1]. But industry trends and other things took my career in the direction of favoring Java, and I've spent most of the last 20+ years thinking of myself as mainly a "Java guy". But I keep buying new C++ books and I always install the C++ tooling on any new box I build. I tell myself that "one day" I'm going to inves…

The programmers on the sound team at the video game company I worked for as an intern in 1998 would always stash a couple of extra void pointers in their classes just in case they needed to add something in later. Programmers should never lose sight of pragmatism. Seeking perfection doesn’t help you ship on time. And often, time to completion matters far more than robustness.

Re: 21st Century C++

#115

Post by midnightclubbed »

gosub100 wrote: post #107
imron wrote: post #94

I want to love C++. Over my career I’ve written hundreds of thousands of lines of it. But keeping up with it is time consuming and more and more I find myself reaching for other languages.

since -14 or -17 I feel no need to keep up with it. thats cool if they add a bunch more stuff, but what I'm using works great now. I only feel some "peer pressure" to signal to other people that I know c++20, but as of now, I've put nothing into it. I think it's best to lag behind a few years (for this language, specifically).

The compilers tend to lag a few years behind the language spec too, especially if you have to support platforms where the toolchains lag latest gcc/clang (Apple / Android / game consoles).

Respectfully, you might want to add at least a few C++20 features into your daily usage?

consteval/constinit guarantees to do what you usually want constexpr to do. Have personally found it great for making lookup tables and reducing the numbers of constants in code (and c++23 expands what can be done in consteval).

Designated initializer is a game-changer for filling structures. No more accidentally populating the wrong value into a structure initializer or writing individual assignments for each value you want to initialize.

Re: 21st Century C++

#116

Post by DonHopkins »

Generalizing Overloading for C++2000

Bjarne Stroustrup, AT&T Labs, Florham Park, NJ, USA

Abstract

This paper outlines the proposal for generalizing the overloading rules for Standard C++ that is expected to become part of the next revision of the standard. The focus is on general ideas rather than technical details (which can be found in AT&T Labs Technical Report no. 42, April 1, 1998).

https://www.stroustrup.com/whitespace98.pdf

Re: 21st Century C++

#117

Post by markus_zhang »

imron wrote: post #94

I want to love C++. Over my career I’ve written hundreds of thousands of lines of it. But keeping up with it is time consuming and more and more I find myself reaching for other languages.

I think it's good enough or side projects. More powerful than C so I don't need to hand roll strings and some algos but I tend to keep a minimum number of features because I'm such an amateur.

Re: 21st Century C++

#118

Post by nialv7 »

How does enforcing profiles per-translation unit make any sense? Some of these guarantees can only be enforced if assumptions are made about data/references coming from other translation units.

Re: 21st Century C++

#119

Post by markus_zhang »

mr_00ff00 wrote: post #108
codr7 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been writing C++ since 1996-ish. Less and less, for sure. Nothing the past few years. They killed it.

If you only read HN, you would think C++ died years ago. As someone who worked in HFT, C++ is very much alive and new projects continue to be created in it simply because of the sheer of amount of experts in it. (For better or for worse)

I have listened to a few podcasts by HFT people. Looks like you try to maximize performance and use a lot of C++ skills. Very interesting to listen to but I wonder how does anyone pick up the skills?

Re: 21st Century C++

#120

Post by William_BB »

midnightclubbed wrote: post #111
erwincoumans wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here. >>contemporary C++30 can express the ideas embodied in such old-style code far simpler IMO, newer C++ versions are becoming more complex (too many ways to do the same thing), less readable (prefer explicit types over 'auto', unless unavoidable) and harder to analyse performance and memory implications (hard to even track down what is happening under the hood). I wish the C++ language and standard library w…

I have used auto liberally for 8+ years; maybe I'm accustomed to reading code containing it but I really can't think of it being a problem. I feel like auto increases readability, the only thing I dislike is that they didnt make it a reference by default. Where do you see difficult to track down performance/memory implications? Lambda comes to mind and maybe coroutines (yet to use them but guessing there may be some…

E.g. `std::ranges::for_each`, where lambda captures a bunch of variables by reference. Like I would hope the compiler optimizes this to be the same as a regular loop. But can I be certain, when compared to a good old for loop?
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