Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

seangoedecke.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 189 posts

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#111

Post by snackbroken »

antonvs wrote: post #97
liontwist wrote: post #94

> Americans tend to be enthusiastic about their company mission - in the extreme, believing that they’re saving the world I would explain this as commitment signaling. I don’t know if they really believe it, but they want to show they are part of the team and the talking points. Adults use language in a less literal way than introverted engineers may be comfortable with.

> Americans tend to be enthusiastic about their company mission - in the extreme, believing that they’re saving the world This is more of a Silicon Valley thing, isn't it? I've worked for or interacted with plenty of non-tech large enterprises where that's certainly not true.

It's certainly more of a thing in SV, but it's not just a SV thing. The US in general is about as far removed from the rest of the world on this axis as SV is from the rest of the US. Experiences vary, of course.

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#112

Post by datavirtue »

pythonguython wrote: post #104
liontwist wrote: post #94

> Americans tend to be enthusiastic about their company mission - in the extreme, believing that they’re saving the world I would explain this as commitment signaling. I don’t know if they really believe it, but they want to show they are part of the team and the talking points. Adults use language in a less literal way than introverted engineers may be comfortable with.

This also seems generational to me. I’m an American younger than 30 and the only people at my company who embody this are the senior people over the age of 40.

There is no quicker way to get yourself put on the back burner than failing to pick up the pom poms. If you are valued by management you will get a few warnings but other than that you go one a silent list for the next restructuring or making an example of.

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#113

Post by SiempreViernes »

liontwist wrote: post #95
dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd say thats due to: (a) Australian culture being quite egalitarian, ie people there see other people just as people rather how much money or power they have, etc and (b) American management being more of the power tripping variety, so they're more likely to wield their power in a threatening and retaliatory fashion, and so underlings tend to be more deferential, including the at-will employment, as you say.

> American management being more of the power tripping variety That’s not an explanation. That’s just restating it. Why would Australians be less tempted by power? Could it be that Americans are more exposed to management and hierarchy in their youth?

Power tripping isn't really about being "tempted by power", rather it's when you become self-righteous because you got granted (some) power.

If you want some sweeping generalisation for why Americans are more prone to this sin, how about the various old cultural patterns of thought that fit under the header "manifest destiny"?

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#114

Post by liontwist »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #113
liontwist wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> American management being more of the power tripping variety That’s not an explanation. That’s just restating it. Why would Australians be less tempted by power? Could it be that Americans are more exposed to management and hierarchy in their youth?

Power tripping isn't really about being "tempted by power", rather it's when you become self-righteous because you got granted (some) power. If you want some sweeping generalisation for why Americans are more prone to this sin, how about the various old cultural patterns of thought that fit under the header "manifest destiny"?

Citing an 19th century political movement is not an explanation for why Americans would be “power tripping”.

What practice or ethos has descended from that time which is currently reinforced?

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#115

Post by tpaschalis »

Regarding the culture bit: I feel that Erin Meyer's "The Culture Map" [1] should be high on any reading list around how to work in a remote environment, especially as a manager. Of course, every individual is different and not everything needs to be taken at face value, but it provides a nice framework to think about how/why other teammates may approach situations in a specific way.

[1] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/22085568-the-culture-map

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#116

Post by liontwist »

jghn wrote: post #108
pythonguython wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This also seems generational to me. I’m an American younger than 30 and the only people at my company who embody this are the senior people over the age of 40.

As a Gen Xer, I figured this was a millennial thing. Given the age ranges you cite that may still be the case. I don't work with enough Gen Zers to paint them with a broad brush. But most of the people I've worked with who wanted feel "part of something" had been 10+ years younger than me.

I think it’s a “has work experience” thing.

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#117

Post by [deleted] »

antonvs wrote: post #99
AnotherGoodName wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will say there are specifically some things my fellow Australians do have do in the USA that we would not in our home country. To my fellow Australians; when you go for the big tech job interview you often have to memorize the company mission statement and values. Yes it's a complete wank. You'll never use it internally. But i have seriously been asked about the companies mission statement for Meta, Google, Amazon…

Meta, Google, and Amazon are outliers, though. Part of their schtick originally was that they're trying to build a cult, although my sense is that may have relaxed a bit as they've grown. IBM used to do a similar thing back in the day. I've worked in tech in the US as an immigrant for over 40 years, and never been quizzed on a mission statement.

[deleted]

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#118

Post by missedthecue »

dsr_ wrote: post #78
typewithrhythm wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think we (Australians) have a real lack of effort=success stories to draw from; if someone has wealth it was probably inherited. In the US if you have wealth it's plausible that you had a great idea that got acquired, or a great skill.

In the US, the most likely cause of someone being wealthy is that their parents were wealthy. But almost every wealthy American tells a story about how they did it by themselves, ignoring the schools that they attended, the services which were available to them, the people their parents associated with, and the ability to make high-risk investments because they had a built-in security net.

80% of US millionaires are first generation

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#119

Post by tolciho »

liontwist wrote: post #102
AnotherGoodName wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will say there are specifically some things my fellow Australians do have do in the USA that we would not in our home country. To my fellow Australians; when you go for the big tech job interview you often have to memorize the company mission statement and values. Yes it's a complete wank. You'll never use it internally. But i have seriously been asked about the companies mission statement for Meta, Google, Amazon…

Reading this thread I’m realizing maybe Americans better understand organizational politics, and this social technology is an unappreciated contributor to productivity. I agree this kind of thing is performative, but let’s steel man the other side. You are looking for a place to spend 8 hours a day doing your most skillful craft, and you don’t want to know what the organization is trying to achieve? Yes I understand…

The Manhattan project, which by some accounts was a fairly large and complicated project, had no mission statement known to most people doing their daily work to who knows what end. Sure, you could go with "stick it to the nazis", and they did have some advertising spam to that effect, but that's down in the "like, duh?" (or less polite forms) as far as mission statements go.

Put another way, how does reciting the mission statement differ from a loyalty dance for chairman Mao? I get that many have an economic (or life) imperative to go along with what the clownsuite orders, but these same people make fun of island savages in the Pacific for "cargo culting".

Re: What it's like working for American companies as an Australian

#120

Post by bink »

SoftTalker wrote: post #106
AnotherGoodName wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will say there are specifically some things my fellow Australians do have do in the USA that we would not in our home country. To my fellow Australians; when you go for the big tech job interview you often have to memorize the company mission statement and values. Yes it's a complete wank. You'll never use it internally. But i have seriously been asked about the companies mission statement for Meta, Google, Amazon…

Must be an SV thing? I've never been asked to recite a mission statement for a company where I was interviewing (or even working at, for that matter). Most assume I don't know much about the company and a good part of the introductory chit-chat in an interview is them telling me about their history and what it is that they do.

I live in the bay area and have worked for several of the big tech companies and startups. The only time I can remember anyone discussing mission statements was when I interviewed at AirBnB. They had a full interview (30 mins IIRC) just about the company mission. The explained that it was very important to the CEO. I apparently failed that interview and they made me do another with a different person about the same topic. It was very awkward.
Post reply on HN