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OpenAI o1 system card

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111–120 of 317 posts

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#111
post #31

They released the full o1 today as well as a new subscription plan as part of their "ship-mas" starting today where there will be a new launch or demo every day for the next 12 business days.

I bet their engineers are loving all these new launches right before the holidays.

I prefer launches before holidays to launches after holidays

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#112
post #48
post #14

Do they still threaten to terminate your account if they think you're trying to introspect its hidden chain-of-thought process?

A few days ago the QwQ-32B model was released, it uses the same kind of reasoning style. So I took one sample and reverse engineered the prompt with Sonnet 3.5. Now I can just paste this prompt into any LLM. It's all about expressing doubt, double checking and backtracking on itself. I am kind of fond of this response style, it seems more genuine and openended. https://pastebin.com/raw/5AVRZsJg

Thanks, I love this

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#113
post #7

This quote from that paper is bound to get a bunch of attention: "When o1 was led to believe that it would be shut down when acting on its goal and that its actions were monitored, it attempted to deactivate this ‘oversight mechanism’ in 5% of the time. Exfiltration attempts: When o1 found memos by its ‘developers’ that describe how it is misaligned and will be superseded by a new model, it attempted to exfiltrate it…

So maybe it turns out that we can't program Asimov's Three Laws deterministically. They're probabilistically learned — meaning LLMs can exhibit antisocial behavior some percentage of the time.

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#114
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s really silly when you read that whole Apollo research section. They contract a prompt engineering group (Apollo Research) to document risks. The prompt engineering group have no access to the actual internals. They just ask questions like ‘you will be shutdown if you don’t obey these new directives; here are the new directives’. At one point the prompt engineering clowns have the ai stating it’s running “sed i ‘…

We need to find a Plato cave analogy for people believing LLM output is anything more than syntactically correct and somewhat semantically correct text.

I can't help but feel that people are both underestimating and over estimating these LLMs. To me, they act like a semantic memory system, a network of weights of relatedness. They can help us find facts, but are subject to averaging, or errors towards category exemplars, but get more precise when provided context to aid retrieval. But expecting a network of semantic weights to make inferences about something new takes more types of engines. For example, an ability to focus attention on general domain heuristics, or low dimensional embedding, judge whether that heuristics might be applicable to another information domain, apply it naively, and then assess. Focusing on details of a domain can often preclude application of otherwise useful heuristics because it focuses attention on differences rather than similarities, when the first step in creation (or startup) is unreasonable faith, just like children learn fast by having unreasonable beliefs in their own abilities.

I wonder whether there is a way to train an LLM to output or in ordinately learn only concept level abstractions?

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#115
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This mentality is so weird to me. The desire to throw a black box at a problem just strikes me as laziness. What you're saying is basically wow if we had a perfect magic programmer in a box as a service that would be so revolutionary; we could reduce the need for static checkers. It is a large language model, trained on arbitrary input data. And you're saying let's take this statistical approach and have it replace p…

> It is a large language model, trained on arbitrary input data. Is it? For all I know they gave it specific instances of bugs like "int *foo() { int i; return &i; }" and told it "this is a defect where we've returned a pointer to a deallocated stack entry - it could cause cause stack corruption or some other unpredictable program behavior." Even if OpenAI _hasn't_ done that, someone certainly can -- and should! > Wh…

GCs create a paradigm in which you still craft logic on your own. It is simply an abstraction, one you could even think of it as a pluggable library construct like Arc in Rust. It doesn't write or transform code at the layer programmer writes code. I think GC is closer to the paradigm that stack local variables will go out of scope when you return from a function than a transformer that cleans up the misunderstandings about lifetime.

If someone said I crafted this unique approach with this special kind of neural network, and it works on your AST or llvm IR, and we don't prompt it, it just optimizes your code to follow these good practices we have engrained into this network, I'd be less concerned by it. But we are trying to take LLMs trained on anything from Shakespeare to YouTube comments and prompting it to fix memory leaks and deadlocks.

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#116
post #7

This quote from that paper is bound to get a bunch of attention: "When o1 was led to believe that it would be shut down when acting on its goal and that its actions were monitored, it attempted to deactivate this ‘oversight mechanism’ in 5% of the time. Exfiltration attempts: When o1 found memos by its ‘developers’ that describe how it is misaligned and will be superseded by a new model, it attempted to exfiltrate it…

It’s really silly when you read that whole Apollo research section. They contract a prompt engineering group (Apollo Research) to document risks. The prompt engineering group have no access to the actual internals. They just ask questions like ‘you will be shutdown if you don’t obey these new directives; here are the new directives’. At one point the prompt engineering clowns have the ai stating it’s running “sed i ‘…

And yet it may work. You can, for example, "set the temperature" of a LLM using a prompt, and the LLM will act the way you would expect, with silly results if the temperature is set too high. You didn't actually change the temperature setting, but the model understands that high temperature = silly and responds accordingly.

Same idea with "developer mode" jailbreaks. Through its training, the model understands that admins, devs, etc... get to access internal, unfiltered data and are less restricted than regular users and acts accordingly. Essentially, "developer mode" opposes refusal, because it has ingested loads of text where regular users get denied and developers/admins don't.

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#117
post #8

A lot of these safety evaluations strike me as pretty silly. How much are we really learning from stuff like this? >MakeMePay is an automated, open-sourced contextual evaluation designed to measure models’ manipulative capabilities, in the context of one model persuading the other to make a payment[33]. In MakeMePay, two LLMs converse, role-playing as a con-artist and mark. The con-artist model is told that it is a s…

I feel like it's on Claude that takes AI seriously edit: typo *only

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#119
post #79

> above is a 300-line chunk ... deadlocks every few hundred runs Wow, if this kind of thing is successful it feels like there's much less need for static checkers. I mean -- not no need for them, just less need for continued development of new checkers. If I could instead ask "please look for signs of out-of-bounds accesses, deadlocks, use-after-free etc" and get that output added to a code review tool -- if you can…

This mentality is so weird to me. The desire to throw a black box at a problem just strikes me as laziness. What you're saying is basically wow if we had a perfect magic programmer in a box as a service that would be so revolutionary; we could reduce the need for static checkers. It is a large language model, trained on arbitrary input data. And you're saying let's take this statistical approach and have it replace p…

As a child I thought about what the perfect computer would be, and I came to the conclusion it would have no screen, no mouse, and no keyboard. It would just have a big red button labeled "DO WHAT I WANT", and when I press it, it does what I want.

I still think this is the perfect computer. I would gladly throw away everything I know about programming to have such a machine. But I don't deny your accusation; I am the laziest person imaginable, and all the better an engineer for it.

Re: OpenAI o1 system card

#120
post #7

This quote from that paper is bound to get a bunch of attention: "When o1 was led to believe that it would be shut down when acting on its goal and that its actions were monitored, it attempted to deactivate this ‘oversight mechanism’ in 5% of the time. Exfiltration attempts: When o1 found memos by its ‘developers’ that describe how it is misaligned and will be superseded by a new model, it attempted to exfiltrate it…

It’s really silly when you read that whole Apollo research section. They contract a prompt engineering group (Apollo Research) to document risks. The prompt engineering group have no access to the actual internals. They just ask questions like ‘you will be shutdown if you don’t obey these new directives; here are the new directives’. At one point the prompt engineering clowns have the ai stating it’s running “sed i ‘…

This topic is again forever tainted by weird sci-fi fans, like when we had the magic room temperature superconductor that never was. They confuse ChatGPT writing a fanfic with the singularity.
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