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The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

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Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#111

Post by Atrus6 »

dododo wrote: post #40
georgespencer wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Upgradability was a defect of technology not being good enough for long periods The other thing to consider is that the same applies to repairing technology. Why are we putting resource into catering for the tiny minority of a given product which experience mechanical failures which we can fix? 90% of BlackBerry users will never change the battery on their device. 100% of BlackBerries have a stupid door on the back…

that doesn't sound like such a great innovation from an environmental point of view. nor a sustainable use of resources. is it easy to re-use parts from these failed devices?

Maintaining a supply of spare parts for a line of notebooks could very well use more natural resources than maintaining a supply of working laptops for replacement.

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#112

Post by rayiner »

moystard wrote: post #41
moystard wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not the only point mentioned in this article. You are forgetting about two aspects: - Environment: Gluing glass and aluminum most probably forbid recycling both of them, that's just a waste. - Cost of repairing: While with previous models, any of us could replace some part of his laptops easily (to repair as well as to upgrade), that won't be possible anymore. That means that it will cost tons of money to cust…

Mea culpa for the recycling part then. I think the upgrade point is still huge: The MBP 2009 that I mention in my previous post has been upgraded twice (RAM and HD). That has allowed me to keep it for three years and in my opinion has justified spending that amount of money in a laptop (2000 euros at that time). I don't know if I would put the same amount if I knew I could not upgrade it.

I don't know if the European Apple-tax makes this tenable, but I just sell my MBP on EBay every year or two. A 16-month old MBP 13.3" is selling for about 70% of its original price on EBay. If you do this three times in four years, you'll have paid about as much as the original price of the machine, for about as long as you were going to keep the machine anyway, but will get little upgrades over time as Apple upgrades that model #.

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#113

Post by ajross »

pasbesoin wrote: post #101
wavephorm wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So $424 extra for the bigger drive, and $176 for the extra ram... that sounds almost reasonable.

Could someone speak to the RAM installation and the materials cost involved in the RAM upgrade? Would it be akin to going from two 4 GB "sticks" to two 8 GB sticks? I'm seeing 4 GB DDR3 DIMM's at around $23, while 8 GB DIMM prices -- a bit scant in quantity -- appear to average in the low $50's. So, say $46 versus $110, for a $64 difference? Very approximately. And I didn't look closely at bus speeds -- just very off…

That's exactly right. The memory interconnect on the board is the same as it is anywhere (the DRAM controller in modern Intel CPUs is inside the chip, so the memory is just directly connected). The only difference is that the chips are soldered to the board instead of being on removable DIMMs.

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#114

Post by ajross »

tjoff wrote: post #109
archgrove wrote: post #7

The argument doesn't really hold up, as we're only given two choices: Upgradable, or amazing screen. If there was a third, "Upgradable and amazing screen" with the applicable price/weight tradeoffs, then the "we can choose" view would be more tenable. Regardless, the lack of upgradability isn't something that bugs me. My last two Apple laptops were "upgradable", but all I ever did was throw some RAM in there. The sub…

These days, the stock specs of the Macbook Retina will be fine for even power users for years; almost certainly the life of a laptop. When the battery dies it will be worthless as a laptop . For a power user that means you are forced to buy a replacement way sooner than you'd want. Just yet another reason for why it is so obvious that apple does mainstream hardware, the sad part is that people confuse it with quality…

The battery is glued in, but apparently it is replaceable via factory service. No, I don't know what that means either (maybe they replace the plastic case part with it?).

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#115

Post by nkohari »

nkassis wrote: post #86
gnaffle wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The glue is designed to come apart, especially when heated. I'd understand you if they used expoxy resin or something like that, but that's not the case. Also, Apple has an incentive to make them recyclable since they offer a free recycling programme. My biggest concern is the RAM, both because I've had RAM failures before which now becomes a motherboard swap, and because I'd rather max out the RAM later when it's ch…

Yeah it's always has been cheaper to buy the ram separately from Apple who seriously overcharges for it. I guess they just closed that "loophole" in their scheme. I'm concerned about the battery. Those things don't last as long as they are claimed. I have a new one in my late 2008 MacBook pro right now.

They also reduced to the price of 16GB of RAM from $800 to $200.

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#116

Post by Scramblejams »

kenrikm wrote: post #90

Purchase New Apple Laptop -> Sell on Ebay after 12months having only lost $200(average) in depreciation -> Purchase New model. I have followed this cycle since 2004, It's kind of like leasing but on my own terms. I personally feel that $200/year is a very small price to pay for a machine that brings in the bacon. I spend a LOT MORE to keep my Adobe CS Master up to date.

I want to see your ads. I've never been able to sell a laptop (Apple or otherwise) of recent vintage and take so small a hit.

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#117

Post by taligent »

jbellis wrote: post #89

I don't buy that thin-and-light requires glued batteries, soldered ram, and proprietary hdd connectors. As exhibits A, B and C I cite my Thinkpad 420s and the machines I almost got instead, the Samsung series 9 and Sony Vaio Z.

It's easy not to buy it when you are deluding yourself.

Thinkpad 420 - Core i5 versus i7. Only up to 8GB. 3cm versus 1.8cm.

Samsung Series 9 - 13inch. Much slower i7 CPU.

Vaio Z - 2.5cm thick at max point versus 1.8cm.

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#118

Post by DennisP »

archgrove wrote: post #7

The argument doesn't really hold up, as we're only given two choices: Upgradable, or amazing screen. If there was a third, "Upgradable and amazing screen" with the applicable price/weight tradeoffs, then the "we can choose" view would be more tenable. Regardless, the lack of upgradability isn't something that bugs me. My last two Apple laptops were "upgradable", but all I ever did was throw some RAM in there. The sub…

Further evidence that Apple has its thumb on the scale: special screws that can't be turned by readily-obtainable screwdrivers.

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#119

Post by koeselitz »

taligent wrote: post #96
MatthewPhillips wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is the Air line for light weight laptops for normal people. I would think that the word Pro signals that this computer is for people who want to do stuff with it beyond what is provided up front.

Pro means professional. It does NOT mean a person who wants the ability to upgrade their RAM/Hard Disk from a third party.

Well, it might. I guess it depends on your profession. If your profession is hardware hacking, IT, or maybe RAM disk upgrading, it seems like that would be included. So I suppose the "Pro" in "Macbook Pro" implicitly excludes those professions.

Re: The New MacBook Pro: Unfixable, Unhackable, Untenable

#120

Post by mikeash »

pasbesoin wrote: post #84
archgrove wrote: post #7

The argument doesn't really hold up, as we're only given two choices: Upgradable, or amazing screen. If there was a third, "Upgradable and amazing screen" with the applicable price/weight tradeoffs, then the "we can choose" view would be more tenable. Regardless, the lack of upgradability isn't something that bugs me. My last two Apple laptops were "upgradable", but all I ever did was throw some RAM in there. The sub…

Off the top of my head (and so, perhaps wrong), I seem to recall the amount Apple is charging for going from 8 GB to 16 GB to be on the order of US$200. [1] For RAM that they are purchasing and installing in volume. That's a lot of net profit into their pocket, for each unit. And that's where I have one particular concern: Apple closing down and engorging itself on yet another market segment (upgrades). You can argue…

Many of Apple's suppliers are also competitors. Samsung, for example, supplies a lot of iPhone parts while also selling iPhone competitors. I doubt it would be that difficult for others to source an equivalent display, if they're willing to pay an equivalent price,
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