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Private company landing on the moon today

intuitivemachines.com

111–120 of 286 posts

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#111
post #58

It's interesting how this feels like a big deal; when I learned of this yesterday, I almost forgot that there have been almost 30 missions to Mars (which I assume is much harder and more expensive) in the years since the last moon landing.

It is a big deal!

While just landing on the moon is definitely much simpler than a Mars mission, this lander is a part of the Artemis program; it's one of the first steps towards developing the Artemis base camp on the moon.

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#112
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Not moving my family to Texas, Florida, or Alabama, for anything. Beautiful states, but I have a daughter. Are women not safe in these states? I'm not sure I'm picking up whatever you are implying.

Women die because they're not allowed to abort nonviable fetuses that would also likely kill them. Seems very unsafe, I wouldn't want to be a woman there.

"Abortion in Texas is illegal in all cases, except to save the mother's life, or prevent substantial impairment of major bodily function." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Texas#:~:text=Abor....

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#113
post #90

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intuitive_Machines_Nova-C#Eagl... : “EagleCam to record lunar landing Just before landing, at approximately 30 m (98 ft) above the lunar surface, the Odysseus lander will eject the EagleCam camera-equipped CubeSat, which will drop onto the lunar surface near the lander, with an impact velocity of about 10 m/s (22 mph). From the surface the EagleCam will attempt to capture the first third…

That's an impressive school project! First university to land on the moon

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#114
post #3

Curious question: as a private company, how do you determine your lunar orbit parameters after a burn? Are they leveraging Earth/orbit-based radar? Or satellites around the moon? Or something else?

Ground infrastructure is important for space missions. Intuitive Machines is operating under a NASA contract for Commercial Lunar Payload Services (CLPS) [1]. As such, they can negotiate access to NASA resources such as DSN and NEN for this mission. Intuitive Machines has also built several ground stations of their own [2]. These allow communications with the spacecraft as well as the range/velocity measurements need…

The name LunaNet made me think of GPS cubesats and ground transponders that would make precise positioning lunar equipment/missions without the latency of coupling to earth systems. It's not that, it seems. Anyone want to start a location-based service company? ;)

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#115
post #90

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intuitive_Machines_Nova-C#Eagl... : “EagleCam to record lunar landing Just before landing, at approximately 30 m (98 ft) above the lunar surface, the Odysseus lander will eject the EagleCam camera-equipped CubeSat, which will drop onto the lunar surface near the lander, with an impact velocity of about 10 m/s (22 mph). From the surface the EagleCam will attempt to capture the first third…

The simplest way to do it is probably just to have a high quality 360 camera, that way you mostly get around the problem of orientation

Yes, but even that isn’t simple, I think. They’d not want to land on top of it, so they’d have to push it out from the lander or have it propel itself away from the lander. If they push it out and it doesn’t have a way to stabilize itself, keeping the lens pointing upwards then will require tight control over that push.

So, I guessed (see below) you’d need power to make the sat orient itself.

However, I googled a bit more, and found this: https://mynews13.com/fl/orlando/space/2024/02/21/embry-riddl..., which says:

“EagleCam will be spring ejected from the Nova-C class lander Odysseus about 30 meters above the lunar surface during the final descent. It will take three images a second from each of its three cameras (a total of nine images a second), capturing its six-second freefall to the surface and Odysseus’ descent and soft landing. About an hour after landing, our team will receive the five images of our choosing. During descent, Dr. Henderson and I will be timing events in landing sequence to match to image numbers to choose the first five images we bring back to Earth. Once we have those images, I will post them directly to @eraueaglecam on Instagram. Shortly after that, they will also be available on @spacetechnologieslab on Instagram and @SpaceTechLab on X (formerly Twitter).”

So, it isn’t a 360 camera, and they’re making 50-ish images and hoping for the best. Doesn’t look like the sat has rockets or that they’re trying to make it possible to make more photos after impact on the moon.

If my guesses/intuition is right we won’t see the actual touchdown (still cool to have anything, of course), but corrections welcome.

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#117

The private lander's mission control looks like the proverbial two-pizza team. Would it that the silent revolution in spaceflight, hidden under the glamour of reusable rockets, is incredibly sophisticated telemetry, communication, on-board automation? A computing stack that's making the 1x mission control a 10x mission control? I understand there will be other teams elsewhere (delivery vehicle, remote sensing etc. et…

better, lighter-weight computing stacks have been a huge boost; that's what made cubesats possible. but the much bigger deal is the dramatic drop in launch costs driven by spacex, even though so far that's only a factor of 3.4 https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cost-space-launches-low-e...

with lightweight computers driven by the cellphone industry, it became possible for a small team or even individual to launch a low-power ham radio satellite or weather satellite. but they can't launch a high-resolution space telescope, earth observing satellite, or high-power communications satellite, nor can they do laser communication pointcasting. and lightweight computers are a crucial enabler for starlink-style communications constellations, but there's only one of those, because that's still a big-money kind of project

suppose that, instead, you had 01980s computing power, but the cost of space launch dropped by a factor of 100. if you need to launch a 200-kg satellite to get the sky-observing optical aperture you're looking for so diffraction doesn't cremate you, you don't care if the onboard computers weigh 1 gram or 10 kilograms. (i mean, you do care, because it lets you cut your launch budget 10%, but it's not a dominant determinant of viability.) with saturn v or zenit 2, according to the plot linked above, that launch would cost you a million dollars. today, at falcon heavy's 1500 dollars per kg, it's 300,000 dollars, which is already a radically more feasible project

spacex's 'starship' is supposed to carry 150 tonnes to leo for 10 million dollars. that's 70 dollars a kilogram. our hypothetical 200-kg aditya athalye space telescope satellite would then cost 14000 dollars to launch. it becomes a hobby project comparable in cost to an engine lathe or a camper van. this would change the economics of space in a profound way, far beyond what cellphone chips have done

for comparison, the csis aerospace security project number for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scout_(rocket_family) on that chart was 118500 dollars per kg in 01961. (but of course you couldn't launch a cubesat on it for that price; it was a military thing.) by 01967 saturn v had brought that down by a factor of 22. after that it remained constant for 43 years until falcon 9 in 02010. starship, if it works, will reduce launch costs by that same factor of 22 over the current falcon heavy number i described above, and by a factor of 73 over saturn v

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always assumed that space was noisy enough that things like wifi wouldn't work on the lunar surface.

If basic radio worked for talking between suits and the landing craft in '69, it surely shouldn't be a surprise that modern frequency-hopping, error corrected, wireless comms, with much more sensitive equipment would work well?

The walkie-talkie toys I had as a kid in the 90s had at least 10x the range of modern home wifi routers. Not to mention how far radio stations broadcast. I'm guessing that's the context they're working from.

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#119
post #90

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intuitive_Machines_Nova-C#Eagl... : “EagleCam to record lunar landing Just before landing, at approximately 30 m (98 ft) above the lunar surface, the Odysseus lander will eject the EagleCam camera-equipped CubeSat, which will drop onto the lunar surface near the lander, with an impact velocity of about 10 m/s (22 mph). From the surface the EagleCam will attempt to capture the first third…

I always assumed that space was noisy enough that things like wifi wouldn't work on the lunar surface.

If you're above the frequency at which the ionosphere becomes reflective (around 30 MHz), why should space be noisier than the Earth's surface? Anything propagating there will reach down here (unless it's something really short wave absorbed by molecular bands in the atmosphere.)

In practice, it's going to be noiser down here, because of all the sources down here.

Re: Private company landing on the moon today

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That these states are antagonistic to women's health. See: Alabama's ruling that frozen embryos for IVF are actually children with all the rights thereof, immediately ceasing IVF procedures. See also: https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/05/us/texas-woman-high-risk-preg... This woman in Texas having to sue to avoid a very dangerous birth of a child who will she will end up having to watch die within a few days. > It states Co…

>> Texas has an exception for births that would threaten the mother's life I saw an interview with a political appointee in charge of exemptions, I believe in texas. He was a hardcore right-wing Christian republican strongly against abortion. He lasted a week. After seeing all the various horror stories, the stuff that obgyns learn of at school, he radically changed his mind and was asking to let doctors again make t…

A source would be great if you can remember that one.
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