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Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

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Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#111

Post by daveslash »

kayodelycaon wrote: post #90
bloopernova wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Completely off topic, but I always wondered what was so special about Deep Space 9's USS Defiant and its "ablative armour". Sure, it was a plot device, but everyone who encountered it seemed astounded by it.

I think it is important to note the Federation previously wasn’t in the business of building warships. They are so technically advanced, they didn’t need them. As a friend of mine put it: Everyone’s best warships are in a dead heat with a luxury liner full of nerds that happens to have guns on it. Starfleet ships didn’t need armor. Their materials science was already so advanced, they had to use structural integrity…

Also off topic, but your comment "It's like giving a tank to a soccer mom and telling her to have fun in traffic" reminds me of the 1995 San Diego Tank Rampage where a guy stole a tank from a Nat'l Guard base and took it on the freeway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6UBW0wrB18

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1995_San_Diego_tank_rampage

Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#112

Post by lgleason »

nonameiguess wrote: post #71
tr_user wrote: post #6

Steps in the right direction, let's get rid of more engineers and replace them with more MBAs. > However, a person familiar with the decision and who asked not to be identified commenting on sensitive personnel decisions, confirmed that Clark’s leaving was not voluntary. > Clark is an engineer. His successor Ringgold has business degrees. However she began her aviation career performing avionics systems maintenance a…

Here's her LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katherine-ringgold-88484140/deta... Interesting that she spent a few years in Belize after getting out of the Air Force. This is the description of her MOS: http://www.mosdb.com/air-force/2A133/mos/1559/ I don't think you're being all that fair here. I have no idea whether she's going to do a good job or not, but there's more to a person than the degree they got. Forme…

From personal experience, once engineers go the MBA route they tend to lose their technical edge and get sucked into the vortex of the MBA universe. It's like some strange indoctrination process.

Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#114

Post by ics »

eastbound wrote: post #63
ics wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While many here won't disagree in general, be wary of holding this sentiment as dogma. There can be bad apples in engineering, and MBAs who can see that whether or not they have the knowledge or experience to make it better themselves. Whether or not they can (or want to) make the next step of hiring better or more honest engineers is what matters then. (I'm not optimistic about Boeing here, but hey.)

Yes but Boeing needs to send a message. A message that they understood how they failed, a message that they apologize, a message that they can be redeemed. Sometimes, it’s about PR. And culture, they haven’t changed. Boeing is still firing engineers, appointing MBAs, getting paid by politicians, and hiring on the revolving doors of local prisons. I wouldn’t even trust a burger flipped by this bunch. Boeing factories…

Sometimes. It's problematic if you're stuck in a loop of sending a message without actually making the hard or risky strategic decisions.

Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#115

Post by fanf2 »

cryptonector wrote: post #66
nocsi wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The details of the MD acquisition is pretty crazy. It was like an unintentional SPAC whereby the company you’re buying owns you

It's pretty common. Company A is doing well, company B is much smaller than company A, A acquires B, A's executives get wonderful retirement parachutes and promote B's executives. Thus A gets to be run by B as if B had acquired A rather than the inverse.

Apple / NeXT

Google / Doubleclick

Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#116

Post by protastus »

lgleason wrote: post #112
nonameiguess wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's her LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katherine-ringgold-88484140/deta... Interesting that she spent a few years in Belize after getting out of the Air Force. This is the description of her MOS: http://www.mosdb.com/air-force/2A133/mos/1559/ I don't think you're being all that fair here. I have no idea whether she's going to do a good job or not, but there's more to a person than the degree they got. Forme…

From personal experience, once engineers go the MBA route they tend to lose their technical edge and get sucked into the vortex of the MBA universe. It's like some strange indoctrination process.

It makes sense. Engineers who get MBAs (or any second degree) usually do it early in their careers, so it's not like they have deep experiences to anchor them after they switch career path.

Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#117

Post by protastus »

verve_rat wrote: post #97
g96alqdm0x wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get the sentiment, but I much prefer this to the alternative, which is rank and file employees getting laid off. It’s much better to have accountability that starts at the top and then trickles down. Too often it feels like workers are the only ones who suffer from the bad decisions of executive leadership.

But it doesn't start at the top, it starts at the middle.

VP and GM are not middle manager titles at Boeing.

Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#118

Post by shininggg »

nonameiguess wrote: post #71
tr_user wrote: post #6

Steps in the right direction, let's get rid of more engineers and replace them with more MBAs. > However, a person familiar with the decision and who asked not to be identified commenting on sensitive personnel decisions, confirmed that Clark’s leaving was not voluntary. > Clark is an engineer. His successor Ringgold has business degrees. However she began her aviation career performing avionics systems maintenance a…

Here's her LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katherine-ringgold-88484140/deta... Interesting that she spent a few years in Belize after getting out of the Air Force. This is the description of her MOS: http://www.mosdb.com/air-force/2A133/mos/1559/ I don't think you're being all that fair here. I have no idea whether she's going to do a good job or not, but there's more to a person than the degree they got. Forme…

[flagged]

Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#119

Post by black_13 »

varjag wrote: post #10
tr_user wrote: post #6

Steps in the right direction, let's get rid of more engineers and replace them with more MBAs. > However, a person familiar with the decision and who asked not to be identified commenting on sensitive personnel decisions, confirmed that Clark’s leaving was not voluntary. > Clark is an engineer. His successor Ringgold has business degrees. However she began her aviation career performing avionics systems maintenance a…

There are bad engineers too.

[dead]

Re: Boeing ousts 737 MAX chief

#120

Post by thefatboy »

ironmagma wrote: post #83
thefatboy wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Totally moronic to let someone go with 18 years of experience. Just move them. What is your moronic comment based on? experience isnt everything.

Based on the fact that we are experiencing a competence crisis right now, particularly in aviation but also more generally. Someone with that many years of technical experience should probably just be mentoring 100% of the time.

so what is the reason he was fired for? certainly not because of his years of experience?
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