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Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

android-developers.googleblog.com

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Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#111

Post by pjmlp »

3abiton wrote: post #105
rstat1 wrote: post #51

Its annoying that I can't use this without greater-than-normal-user access.

It is still baffling that root is so shunned upon in the Android communities. Imagine not having root access to your linux laptop. Magisk users are persecuted and punished by Google for getting root access, which is the bare minimun for a device you own.

Easy, that is how many of us use UNIX like OSes, macOS, Windows devices on corporate environments.

Not everyone gets to be root, and even for devs there are IT management tools that only allow root for specific use cases, or time boxed.

Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#112

Post by walteweiss »

VierScar wrote: post #103
usrusr wrote: post #92

Back at university one lecture included an infographic about how CPU and operating system features like MMU, increasing register width and the like all started at mainframe-scale installations and trickled down to desktop scale systems and later to handheld devices at a surprisingly consistent pace. It was the time w2k was trying to make NT features mainstream and J2ME arrived on phones. I extrapolated a little and m…

You can't claim you're not surprised? So you can claim you are surprised? You're surprised by this. I feel like I'm trying to understand double negatation logic in code haha

I have difficulties to decipher this as well.

In English, there is a sentence structure like ‘I ain’t telling nobody’, which means ‘I won’t tell anyone’, but for me it’s difficult to decipher as well. Why it’s not like ‘I’m telling nobody’ or ‘I’m not telling anyone’? Why the double negative — ain’t and nobody — means negative as well.

Same issue is here. I don’t understand whether they were surprised or not. I assume they are not surprised. But the difficulty of the phrasing makes me wonder the meaning behind it.

Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#113

Post by walteweiss »

VierScar wrote: post #110
hiatus wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the same as saying "I can't say I'm not surprised"—meaning they are unsurprised.

I think that's saying they're surprised. The saying in other contexts: "I can't say I'm not impressed" -> I'm impressed. "I can't say you didn't try" -> you tried. I think you mean "I can't say I'm surprised" -> this is not at all surprising. But that's just one negative.

And what about ‘I’m not telling nobody’ which means ‘I won’t tell anyone’?

Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#115

Post by codedokode »

keepamovin wrote: post #96
Animats wrote: post #79

So what is something running in this virtual machine allowed to do? Talk to the Internet? Talk to the screen? Talk only to whatever started it? How much of this is closed source?

Possibly one cybersecurity-related thing you could do is run a headless browser inside this VM, and bridge the network requests to the host network (a little bit like Docker). Using my open-source BrowserBox^0 project then you could have a "bit more isolated" Browser running on your Android device that would add "VM escape" to any zero-day exploit chain that might be a risk. This is speculation tho, I don't know if i…

Why do you need VM for isolation? ARM architecture already provides tools for isolation, like MMU and privilege levels. Why do you need another kernel, emulation of hardware devices? It is completely wrong method.

Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#116

Post by codedokode »

Animats wrote: post #79

So what is something running in this virtual machine allowed to do? Talk to the Internet? Talk to the screen? Talk only to whatever started it? How much of this is closed source?

This is probably for playing DRM content, apps like Netflix will provide an encrypted VM image to play a movie.

Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#117

Post by codedokode »

pjmlp wrote: post #111
3abiton wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is still baffling that root is so shunned upon in the Android communities. Imagine not having root access to your linux laptop. Magisk users are persecuted and punished by Google for getting root access, which is the bare minimun for a device you own.

Easy, that is how many of us use UNIX like OSes, macOS, Windows devices on corporate environments. Not everyone gets to be root, and even for devs there are IT management tools that only allow root for specific use cases, or time boxed.

No, I think the reason is that not letting user have full control over hardware is more profitable for manufactures, government and economy as a whole.

Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#118

Post by pjmlp »

codedokode wrote: post #117
pjmlp wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Easy, that is how many of us use UNIX like OSes, macOS, Windows devices on corporate environments. Not everyone gets to be root, and even for devs there are IT management tools that only allow root for specific use cases, or time boxed.

No, I think the reason is that not letting user have full control over hardware is more profitable for manufactures, government and economy as a whole.

Anyone that misuses their root account to have an exploit taking place inside the organization gets shown the door.

Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#119

Post by anonymous_sorry »

walteweiss wrote: post #113
VierScar wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's saying they're surprised. The saying in other contexts: "I can't say I'm not impressed" -> I'm impressed. "I can't say you didn't try" -> you tried. I think you mean "I can't say I'm surprised" -> this is not at all surprising. But that's just one negative.

And what about ‘I’m not telling nobody’ which means ‘I won’t tell anyone’?

That's a common enough error that it's become well-known slang. People are used to it and can figure out the intended meaning by intonation and context. Although it's still one of those things that can confuse folks who aren't fluent in English.

"I can't say I'm surprised" or "I'm not surprised" would be much clearer here if the intention is to say this is NOT surprising. "I can't say I'm not surprised" is confusing enough that the intention is not clear. Logically it implies surprise.

Re: Virtual Machine as a core Android Primitive

#120

Post by helloooooooo »

codedokode wrote: post #114

Looks like something absolutely overengineered and unnecessary. Why do you need a virtual machine with a separate kernel? Why do you need to protect it from kernel? I guess, it is made mostly for playing DRM content?

One prime example is to protect credentials. Windows already uses this in a feature called credential guard.
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