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The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

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Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#111
The book "Mothers and Others" discusses this at length, positing not only did mothers have much more "Alloparental" support in the past, but this was the key fact that allowed the evolution of our big brains. That is, alloparental involvement was a necessary precursor to homo sapian big-brain evolution and the key thing that was lacking in other apes.

Very interesting and highly reccomended

Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#112

The book Hunt, Gather, Parent touches on this a bit. It takes 3-4 humans, not necessarily adults but cousins and whatnot, to take care of a child. Two? 6-8. Since western societies broke up tight knit communities, the support system for this in the west has been lacking and jerry rigged with tired parents and nannies etc ever since. The reason for the breakup is fun - https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2019/11/ro…

So does The Anthropology of Childhood, which is a fun book: https://jakeseliger.com/2015/02/10/the-anthropology-of-child....

Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vast majority of child abusers are male and known to the child and family (not strangers), so there is some evidence behind the bias, I suppose.

All stereotypes grow from a kernel of some truth. Lets calculate. - 80-90% of child abusers are male. (Lets use 90% further on). - Us population is 330 million. (So half will be 165m male). - It has 750 thousand registered sex offenders Calculations: - 750t * 0.9 = 675t male offenders; 675t / 165000t = 0.4% of male population in us are registered sex offenders. (1 out of 243 males). - 750t * 0.1 = 75t female offender…

The numbers are even worse when removing young boys.

Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only thing I would like to add to this thinking is that it also explains cultural norms. If a child is getting input from that many different adults it becomes an averaging of the culture norms.

> If a child is getting input from that many different adults it becomes an averaging of the culture norms. More directly, it greatly softens the inevitable blows from highly-concentrated, inexperienced parenting.

I would also add that by the time of becoming a parent every girl was already familiar with most of the chores and tasks of raising a child and most likely familiar with giving birth because no one went away to hospital to give birth - it happened at home.

Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#115
> He argues that recent changes in UK policy show childcare is becoming more of a priority for the government

Seems like some massive cognitive dissonance going on here. Outsourcing childcare is why there would be less attentive care in modern society. Virtually all women - old, young, mothers or not - would stay together with the children at all times in these hunter gatherer societies.

We already have great daycares (albeit expensive) which are apparent contributing to this less attentive care. If we want to return to the old ways that would be communities of women staying home together.

Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#116
post #107
post #54

> the researchers say that children may be "evolutionarily primed" to expect exceptionally high levels of physical contact and care, What strikes me here is the phrase, "exceptionally high levels." I imagine children need a "normal" level of care; it's only "exceptionally high" in comparison to the deprived state of family systems in these degenerate times. I often reflect on the understanding in Attachment Theory, w…

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Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#117
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WEIRD = Western Educated Industrialised Rich Democratic

Imo it’s a derogatory term people in … alternative circles, like to use.

It was invented by Western psychologists upon discovering that the results of their experiments on Western psychology students did not, after all, generalise to results that were applicable to all humans.

If you’re hanging round in circles that use it as a derogatory term, you’re hanging round in the wrong circles.

Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#118
post #54

> the researchers say that children may be "evolutionarily primed" to expect exceptionally high levels of physical contact and care, What strikes me here is the phrase, "exceptionally high levels." I imagine children need a "normal" level of care; it's only "exceptionally high" in comparison to the deprived state of family systems in these degenerate times. I often reflect on the understanding in Attachment Theory, w…

I think the word "exceptionally" arises when comparing with other animals, the amount of effort a human child needs from its parents and family until an advanced age is unprecedented in other terrestrial companions.

Indeed, it always a source of surprise to me that human babies will cry regardless of the situation, whereas the offspring of other animals seem to have an instinct to remain quiet while the mother is not about, or there's a perceived danger.

Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#119

We can only move forward, not backward. The hunter-gatherer existence is often endowed with some notion of pristine, peaceful existence in harmony with nature, which is likely far from the actual truth. That said, I for one find many aspects (but not all!) of the present situation unsatisfactory, where the needs of macroeconomy and national priorities supersedes many of our most basic needs as humans. This article co…

I look at it from this perspective, we have been hunting-gathering for 95% of our time on earth, it may be the case that from our bubble we think we are "more advanced", but if we think about the test of time, we have not yet passed, and call me crazy, but it seems that this "advancement" of ours does not hold up for long at this level.

Today we know that many "non-advanced" cultures, aware of the limits of growth, limited the consumption of resources in many imaginative ways.

It is ok to say, hey you did this better than me.

Re: The key to mother and child well-being may be many caregivers

#120
post #62

This is once of the things that remote work/homeworking may enable, if companies don't succeed in taking it away. If people can rely on getting remote work, they can arrange their living situation to improve the rest of their life, instead of for work: - young people living in large halls, to improve their dating prospects - groups of friends living close together across job moves, enabling longer term friendships -…

I laud your foreseen outcomes but we are far away from everything else we'd need. ex: A scenario where large public halls are widely built for young workers. An income to housing ratio that would allow people to make block-level housing choices. Widely available, affordable, walkable neighborhoods.

As I mention in my other comment, halls for young workers is the one I've actually seen happen already, albeit only at the top end of the market
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