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A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

openrw.org

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Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#111

Post by sandworm101 »

kevinmchugh wrote: post #107
sandworm101 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clean rooms protect from patent issues, but do little to protect against copyright or trademark actions. The fact that one creates totally new code from scratch means nothing if the end product is too similar to the existing copyrighted work.

No, clean rooms are a mechanism that allows a team to avoid copyright infringement by ensuring that the developers have never seen the copyrighted code.

The code avoids copyright, if it is actually different. The end product doesn't if it is still similar to the copyrighted work. Use a computer to rewrite Harry Potter all you want, but if it comes up with the same book it doesn't matter how you got there.

Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#112

Post by marcinzm »

sandworm101 wrote: post #87
kevinmchugh wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Openmw is a clean room implementation. Bethesda could throw a legal fit regardless but it would be indefensible for them to do so.

Clean rooms protect from patent issues, but do little to protect against copyright or trademark actions. The fact that one creates totally new code from scratch means nothing if the end product is too similar to the existing copyrighted work.

That's literally the exact opposite of reality:

> Clean-room design is useful as a defense against copyright infringement because it relies on independent creation. However, because independent invention is not a defense against patents, clean-room designs typically cannot be used to circumvent patent restrictions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clean_room_design

Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#113

Post by [deleted] »

sandworm101 wrote: post #111
kevinmchugh wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, clean rooms are a mechanism that allows a team to avoid copyright infringement by ensuring that the developers have never seen the copyrighted code.

The code avoids copyright, if it is actually different. The end product doesn't if it is still similar to the copyrighted work. Use a computer to rewrite Harry Potter all you want, but if it comes up with the same book it doesn't matter how you got there.

[deleted]

Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#114

Post by marcinzm »

sandworm101 wrote: post #111
kevinmchugh wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, clean rooms are a mechanism that allows a team to avoid copyright infringement by ensuring that the developers have never seen the copyrighted code.

The code avoids copyright, if it is actually different. The end product doesn't if it is still similar to the copyrighted work. Use a computer to rewrite Harry Potter all you want, but if it comes up with the same book it doesn't matter how you got there.

That's not a clean room implementation. A clean room would be having a description for the game of quidditch (game rules are not copyrightable just like specifications for software) and then writing a background story to explain it without ever having read a single word of Harry Potter. If that comes out anywhere similar to the Harry Potter books I'd be utterly amazed.

Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#115

Post by mikrotikker »

MiddleEndian wrote: post #27

I'm surprised there are no open source GTA 2 clones (either straight-up or just similar games of that style). The total topdown PoV with rotating sprites seems like it would be ideal for low/zero budget enthusiast projects.

There is newer one battle Royale and multiplayer I can't remember the name. It's on steam came out in the last couple of years.

GTA2 was a LAN party favourite.

Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#116

Post by kevinmchugh »

sandworm101 wrote: post #111
kevinmchugh wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, clean rooms are a mechanism that allows a team to avoid copyright infringement by ensuring that the developers have never seen the copyrighted code.

The code avoids copyright, if it is actually different. The end product doesn't if it is still similar to the copyrighted work. Use a computer to rewrite Harry Potter all you want, but if it comes up with the same book it doesn't matter how you got there.

In Sony v Connectix a judge found that software designed for compatibility deserved less protection than literary works.

Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#117

Post by skocznymroczny »

jmyeet wrote: post #49

I'm honestly shocked how game companies can refuse free money by remastering old popular titles. And when they do actually do it, they do it so cheaply that the resulting product is just godawful. Case in point: Warcraft 3 [1]. This remaster was not only awful technically but Blizzrad changed the ToS on third-party maps so they owned all the IP because they didn't want a repeat of the Dota fiasco where Dota 2 sprange…

Have they really changed the ToS that much? My understanding was that by EULA the content you create through Warcraft 3 World Editor always belonged to Blizzard and Reforged hasn't really changed much in that aspect.

On the other hand, a lot of custom maps for Warcraft 3 were based on external IPs (Dragonball Z maps etc) so it's not something Blizzard can claim anyway.

Even when transitioning to Dota 2 they had to purge some of the more obvious IP things that existed in Dota 1, such as the sorceress character named "Lina Inverse" became "Lina".

Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#118

Post by skocznymroczny »

netruk44 wrote: post #38
LAC-Tech wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very sad to see. OpenMW is a very similar project for a game of the same vintage - Morrowind. Still in active development (last commit 1 hour ago as of writing). To think Bethesda would be fine with openMW, but rockstar had to shut down openRW.

Bethesda has, in fact, taken issue with OpenMW in the past [0]. Bethesda at least had a specific reason for going after OpenMW, though. They’re okay with it now under “certain conditions” that I’m sure the OpenMW devs aren’t going to argue with. Their main ask was that the OpenMW devs don’t advertise OpenMW as a way to play Morrowind on Android (or other platforms besides PC). And there’s an understanding that OpenMW…

"And there’s an understanding that OpenMW’s “intention” isn’t solely to be a way to play Morrowind, but also to implement a generic RPG engine and editor that uses Morrowind’s gameplay and file structure. For someone to make their own game with, not using any of Morrowind’s assets. (I’m not sure if any such game exists, though)"

To be honest, every project of this kind claims that. And in reality, everyone knows 99% of usecases for such engine is to play the original game. Sometimes there are new IPs being created on such engine. For example recently there's been some "boomer shooters" coming out using engines which were made originally to play classic DOOM or Duke Nukem 3D. But such cases are rare.

Re: A Grand Theft Auto III Re-Implementation

#119

Post by [deleted] »

chmod775 wrote: post #100
Philpax wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's correct - OpenRW is a from-scratch reimplementation of GTA3, while re3 is a manual decompilation that's capable of reproducing the original executable (or something very close to it). Both projects are very impressive in their own right. When re3 went public, OpenRW archived their repository; when re3 was DMCA'd, OpenRW unarchived their repository; and when re3 was sued, OpenRW ceased development. (This is bas…

Worth noting that in case of the lawsuit they settled, with terms likely being "don't do it again". https://www.pcgamer.com/take-two-dismisses-lawsuit-against-g...

[deleted]
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