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The Federated App Problem

plug-world.com

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Re: The Federated App Problem

#111
Registered at Lemmy.world - jumped accross to kbin.sh have to register but my details are 'already in use'.

Can not log in, can not register.

Can not be bothered (for today, at least). I will try again, maybe with different credentials, but it shouldn't be this difficult.

Quick edit: happened on other fed sites, too. Worked on others, too.

Re: The Federated App Problem

#112
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problematic users do tend to congregate on certain servers because they keep getting banned from better moderated ones. Eventually they find the ones that won't ban them, and now well moderated instances have an easy target to block them wholesale. That's how you end up with instances like explodingheads.

The only caveat is that what's well moderated and what's not depends on who you ask.

That isnt a caveat so much as a fearure

Re: The Federated App Problem

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same way people manage to decide whether to buy buns at the bakery on the right rather than the one on the left or donate to the NGO1 rather than NGO2 doing exactly the same, you ought to manage to judge which instance is a better fit or if it even matters in your case. >why would all problematic users congregate on the same server? Isn’t it far more likely that you’ll have to block individual users across numero…

I have also noticed that in some cases....user blocks are being replicated to an instance I run. I have this huge and ever growing list of banned users on my single user instance in lemmy. ANd I have no idea who is banning and why...I doesnt seem to affect me...but its odd

>I have also noticed that in some cases....user blocks are being replicated to an instance I run. I have this huge and ever growing list of banned users on my single user instance in lemmy. ANd I have no idea who is banning and why...I doesnt seem to affect me...but its odd

IIUC (and I may not) there are blocklists that are shared between fediverse instances that, depending on the configuration, are automagically updated/applied on a regular basis.

Perhaps that's what's going on with your instance?

Edit: Modified comment to address GP's specific issue.

Re: The Federated App Problem

#114
post #4

I agree with the premise of the article. I’m a new Mastodon user trying to give the platform an honest shot, but I can’t understand why I would choose any particular server over another. Why choose anything other than the pseudo-default Mastodon.social? If I’m forced to choose another server, is that choice actually meaningful? I feel like I’m randomly picking between Hachyderm and TechHub.io and others. One advantag…

What you see on Mastodon is (a) stuff posted by other people on your server, and (b) stuff posted by people on other servers whom people on your server are following. So your choice of server has a strong affect on your feed. And hosting your own instance means that you really need to start following loads of people if you want to keep an eye on what's going on. I suppose I can see this as a good thing, or at least vaguely see why other people might see it as a good thing, but I mostly find it annoying. (It also means that there isn't an overall Mastodon zeitgeist, the way there may have been with Twitter.)

Another, even more annoying side-effect, is that conversations may have bits silently missing, if they're posted by someone not on your instance. I have been reading a thread of seven posts, posted by five different people, and then looked at that same thread from another server and found that it was actually sixteen posts, posted by eight different people, several of which had not federated to my server. I have been irritated by two different people asking me the same questions, leading to two separate threads hanging off my initial comment, covering exactly the same subject, until I looked at the conversations from their servers and realised that they were invisible to each other.

I would never use Mastodon for anything serious: the chance of irritating people, missing context, and talking at cross purposes are far too high.

Re: The Federated App Problem

#115
I don't get these posts. I've yet to hear someone developing federated social media whose goal is mass uptake. Mastodon is designed to avoid viral posts for instance. I use latex and vim to produce pdf documents. I wouldn't write a long post saying "I don't see this replacing ms office any time soon".

Re: The Federated App Problem

#116
That’s interesting. I don’t hear some of the other issues, such as updating and propagating changes to servers and clients. (Although, I wonder to what extent AI can help with that).

Re: The Federated App Problem

#117

If the goal is to talk about your interests with strangers (and not pull in your whole family and political and journalistic class), some minimal federation friction could be beneficial actually, as a soft filter. Maybe it's worth it to have some common pre-Eternal September spaces on the Internet, even it means not building unicorn empires. The latter seems to be a mindset people aren't able to shake off for some re…

I wonder if the rise in smartphones as people’s default device has indeed reduced the likelihood of gathering such knowledgeable and worthwhile strangers together. Even many people with intellectual acumen and adventurousness, who might have tried an alternative community, are using devices that discourage longform text and logging into obscure websites.

Case in point, I am a member of some hobby and travel communities where, a decade ago, many people had blogs where they described their experiences with rich, detailed text. Now those same people hardly even touch a keyboard and are content to maybe just post a few pictures. They also are more likely these days to engage in political battle, since political polarization is so much greater than it used to be.

Re: The Federated App Problem

#118
post #4

I agree with the premise of the article. I’m a new Mastodon user trying to give the platform an honest shot, but I can’t understand why I would choose any particular server over another. Why choose anything other than the pseudo-default Mastodon.social? If I’m forced to choose another server, is that choice actually meaningful? I feel like I’m randomly picking between Hachyderm and TechHub.io and others. One advantag…

I think the idea is to find a local server where you know the admin and the other local users that have similar community values.

Re: The Federated App Problem

#119
post #62
post #18

As far as email is concerned, one reason why you don't see as much as self-hosting or any frankly, is due to deliverability. Doesn't help to have your own mail server when all the mail coming from it is classified as spam and filtered out of inboxes leaving you to have to use a "trusted" hosted provider to ensure your email actually works as you'd expect.

Is it really a problem or cargo culting? I certainly thought it was a problem, but I know a sysadmin that runs two small businesses's email on prem and he says that deliverability, even to major providers, has never been a problem, as long as you set up everything right.

I don't know how cargo culting figures into this. Nobody is setting up cardboard boxes and thinking it's a mail server :).

What does it mean to set everything up right? Out of the box postfix, sendmail, dovecat, etc., no longer generally work, even with DKIMs, and other necessary domain verifications.

I have heard of some admins opening cases with some of the large hosts to ensure their mail goes through, but seeing how those are all big cos with little no guaranteed lines of contact or follow through I wouldn't hold my breath on it working or being a long-term solution as they can easily blacklist you at any time with you having no recourse.

I'd love to hear a counter argument, as it's also the same thing for basic transactional mail sending, there's a reason everyone switched to SMTP hosts such as Mandrill, Sendgrid, and AWS, deliverability.

Re: The Federated App Problem

#120
post #17
post #4

I agree with the premise of the article. I’m a new Mastodon user trying to give the platform an honest shot, but I can’t understand why I would choose any particular server over another. Why choose anything other than the pseudo-default Mastodon.social? If I’m forced to choose another server, is that choice actually meaningful? I feel like I’m randomly picking between Hachyderm and TechHub.io and others. One advantag…

> ... but I can’t understand why I would choose any particular server over another. Email is often a good analogy for questions like these: Why do you pick one email service over the other? Maybe you think the domain is cool. Maybe you heard that they are reliable or have features that others don't. Maybe your university, company or other community you belong to runs its own service. Or you decide to host your own. O…

But gmail is not blocked by hotmail or yahoo. You can send and receive from different providers.
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