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How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

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Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#111

Post by JohnFen »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #50
divan wrote: post #47

The problem is that internet is both a library and a public place. You need library for information and for work, and internet delivers here better than anything else - almost any information is available instantly. But unlike library with silence and no distractions you're at the same time in the middle of the giant public square, where all the people from your social circle also available instantly. It's like study…

> I really believe this social aspect of reachability of people (friends, haters or some people on internet you follow) is crucial. It's not about apps or a screen time, it's about social connection (even ephemeral) that gives this gratification and makes our brains summoning the apps. This. I've concluded the same, observing my own interaction patterns. I use very little social media (would've ditched Facebook if no…

> I do, however, have a huge HN problem.

You and me both. But, if I'm to have a serious addiction problem, I suppose I can live with this one.

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#112

Post by nobrains »

prox wrote: post #10
nobrains wrote: post #7

But its more than that. I might visit Reddit and Hacker News, not because the app summoned me via notifications, but because my brain summoned the app, after just a 15 minute hiatus. The issue is that browser and certain apps are available to me on the phone instantly. And there are no good controls to help me me MINDFUL. What I want from the phone (I use an iPhone): - Upon every unlock, or upon every app open, I sho…

As the old saying goes, there is an app for that. Here you go : https://one-sec.app/

Amazing! It even has the functionality I was looking for: https://i.imgur.com/usvP6Xq.png

>> I should receive a popup asking me why I want to use the app/phone

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#113

Post by nologic01 »

twic wrote: post #67
sledgehammers wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have spoken my exact thoughts aloud, thanks. Let's start working on the theory!

I tend think the transition to living online is basically a repeat of the transition to living in cities. That is, from villages to cities is the same as cities to online. There's more of everything - people, stuff, contact, density, access, coincidences. I wonder if we can learn anything from the previous transition.

Yes, i really dig this analogy. It also shows that the transition is potentially a game changer of extraordinary significance given the immensity of that global digital city. Even lingustic barriers will soon be a thing of the past.

Its interesting to note that cities were despised from their very beginnings and even today many people cant tolerate them.

But many many social inventions may provide interesting and useful analogies: zoning rules, police, firefighters, quiet areas and parks, thoroughfares. Also, the privacy one enjoys in the countryside is reduced but not eliminated - despite the density people still have private spaces.

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#114

Post by nicbou »

photochemsyn wrote: post #64

Here's an idea: an app that forces you to solve a fairly complex mathematical puzzle every time you try to open any social media app. This is lifted from Larry Niven's Ringworld sci-fi novels (specifically, a wirehead addict uses this approach to limit their consumption). Mobile devices don't seem to make this very easy to do, though, you need a app wrapper of some kind which seems fairly case-specific.

Set a hard password, save it somewhere, log out and let the browser forget it.

On desktop just use SelfControl.

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#115

Post by PartiallyTyped »

PartiallyTyped wrote: post #11
nobrains wrote: post #7

But its more than that. I might visit Reddit and Hacker News, not because the app summoned me via notifications, but because my brain summoned the app, after just a 15 minute hiatus. The issue is that browser and certain apps are available to me on the phone instantly. And there are no good controls to help me me MINDFUL. What I want from the phone (I use an iPhone): - Upon every unlock, or upon every app open, I sho…

One of the worst decisions I have made, in my life, was purchasing Apollo for reddit, that's how good the app is. I have scrolled about 40km with my current reddit account over 40 days. Honestly, I don't want to know how many total. I have tried setting up screentime, but I need a hard lock mode... Apple allows you to setup focus modes with whitelists that use location and time, that might do the trick.

I installed the “one sec” app suggested in a sibling comment. I tried opening it about 25 times in the previous 7 hours.

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#116

Post by ben_w »

imartin2k wrote: post #108
gonehome wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recognize your account too, and while I’m way less prolific I can relate to the same conversational draw and compulsion. I noticed I had it less when working in the office in the Bay Area where it was more possible to engage in these kinds of discussions more frequently in person. I suspect it’s just hard to get that kind of group together in the world outside of weird circumstances so it’s easier to find it online…

Interesting. I almost never comment on HN, and if I do, it tends to be without a lot of substance, like this one. The thought of feeling a compulsion to participate in a lot of HN comment threads is very hard for me to imagine. My general reflexive feeling towards commenting is “waste of my time”. Particularly if there’s the risk to end up in some heated argument. Those are the worst.

> Particularly if there’s the risk to end up in some heated argument. Those are the worst.

Yeah; that's why I blocked twitter on my desktop and deleted the app and saved passwords on my phone.

Fortunately, HN doesn't seem to face those with anything like the same frequency, and flagged sub-threads seem to get snipped out of comment history at least by default, so I find here to be a good place for discussion.

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#117

Post by dredmorbius »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #94
TeMPOraL wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my case, it's likely because I post a lot of sophisticated sounding nonsense - I'm the biological ancestor of ChatGPT :). That, plus I tend to binge on HN, which makes my comments come in bursts - I either post nothing, or comment in 15 different subthreads across 5 different submissions simultaneously. So when you spot me in one place, you'll probably see me everywhere that day. Other high-karma accounts likely p…

You might ask to get limited. My account is limited to a about three comments per hour. If I exceed I’m told to slow down. dang didn’t like one of my posts—not sure why this solution was chosen but it was. I’ve also set my maxvisit and minaway on my profile. So I can get more things done.

TeMPOraL has extensive experience with trying to limit HN distractions, see in part:

http://jacek.zlydach.pl/blog/2020-05-25-blocking-distraction...>

But see: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36125138>

I also recall him specifically asking dang to disable his account, which ended up being accomplished through either the "noprocrast" or "limit" features, though I can't find the comment (it was likely either on HN or the Fediverse).

Somewhat amusingly, I happened to catch his re-appearance on HN within 45 minutes of his resuming commenting, for whatever that has to say about the both of us.

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#118

Post by dredmorbius »

intrasight wrote: post #65
em500 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One way to moderate this is to remove them from your phone and just access them from a PC end of day. There is no value from 24/7 instant access to Reddit or HN (or the majority of network connected apps if you think about it), as opposed to browsing for an hour or two at the end of the day if you have some downtime.

This is my solution for Reddit and HN - which are my "problem" sites as well. Like just now reading this thread anonymously on my phone and then at a later time, after some more contemplation, going to my computer and writing this comment. That break does three things. First, I get to think about why I am commenting. Second, if I decide that I do still want to comment, I've had some "offline" time to think about it.…

I've largely taken to the "multiple devices, only one with a sign-on" approach.

I'll read HN / linked articles from my e-ink tablet, which has Internet but for which I've severely restricted any authenticated services.

If I want to comment, I've got to 1) remember and 2) go to a Real Computer.

(Having a full keyboard available is another game-changer. Soft keyboards / touch input on a mobile device not only hugely increases my typo rate but my ability to think and compose, it's brain damage.)

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#119

Post by WorldMaker »

Hayarotle wrote: post #102
divan wrote: post #47

The problem is that internet is both a library and a public place. You need library for information and for work, and internet delivers here better than anything else - almost any information is available instantly. But unlike library with silence and no distractions you're at the same time in the middle of the giant public square, where all the people from your social circle also available instantly. It's like study…

It's not just a public place, but a very specific type of public place: a shopping mall. Were it just a public square with people from your social circle, then it wouldn't be as dangerous. As a shopping mall, it's full of advertisements, slot machines, games, fast food, sales clerks trying to lead you into the place they want you to be, etc. But it is also the place where almost all your friends are, and almost all t…

Not to mention that slot machines are notoriously addictive and most apps that aren't games have been incentivized both by advertisers or in lieu of additional advertiser revenue to include variations of slot machines in their feature lists because that attracts attention and keeps attention.

Re: How to Stare at Your Phone Without Losing Your Soul

#120

Post by WorldMaker »

doublerabbit wrote: post #14
nobrains wrote: post #7

But its more than that. I might visit Reddit and Hacker News, not because the app summoned me via notifications, but because my brain summoned the app, after just a 15 minute hiatus. The issue is that browser and certain apps are available to me on the phone instantly. And there are no good controls to help me me MINDFUL. What I want from the phone (I use an iPhone): - Upon every unlock, or upon every app open, I sho…

Shuffle your app icons to different locations on the the home screen. Added bonus to folders. Because all apps are in the same locations your muscles memory kicks in. If you shift your apps regularly, you actually have to hunt for the app disrupting the psychological behaviour conditioning. It also gives you a mini panic attack but allows you to break free of the whole close app, reopen same app syndrome.

Focus Modes let you have different Home screens at different times of day. That can give the brain different context moments that kick muscle memory in different directions.
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