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The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

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Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#111

Post by roenxi »

TheFattestNinja wrote: post #22
roenxi wrote: post #6

In theory I probably do agree with the bill as presented in the article, there are 2 reservations that should be bought up. Firstly, the EU has a history of crippling their native tech industry to the general detriment of the EU. It is quite possible that this will end up being one more nail in the coffin. Secondly, they're fighting economics on this one. AI seems to be cheap and accessible. In practice controlling t…

(many EU countries have laws that ban Nazism and its derivatives btw. They are not working flawlessly everywhere but they are there and do "some" effect).

And yet they have about the same amount of trouble with Nazis as ... more or less every other country in the world. Very mysterious.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#112

Post by endisneigh »

zirgs wrote: post #57
criley2 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can extrapolate this opinion all the way to "the only moral human existence is de-industrialization and return to hunter/gatherer lifestyle, and reducing humanity from billions to a million or less". You drew the line at software and automobiles, but it's not hard (and not a slippery slope) to authentically draw the line much further. All of civilization is bad for the planet and for us as well. Bread was a mista…

Surveillance capitalism isn't necessary for society to function. I can live just fine without google, fb and tiktok serving me ads. I can store my files in the cloud just fine without microsoft and google scanning them. Navigation apps work just fine without uploading location history to google. A lot of those so-called "innovations" aren't necessary.

[flagged]

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#113

Post by hef19898 »

lvl102 wrote: post #104
hef19898 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If those poor, under-priviledged US tech just a helping hand in defending themselves against those evil, democratic governments... Communism it is! /s On a more serious note, you are aware of the fact that a lot of the material and money Ukraine is gettong comes from European NATO countries and the EU? It is almost like an, whats the word again, alliance supporting Ukraine instead of a single country.

Is it an alliance when EU led by Germany funded Putin regime for the past two decades? Interesting. By the way, more than 85% of the funding is coming from the US. My point really is that even if EU regulations against US big techs are well-intentioned, they’re effectively doing the work for China. I don’t understand what the Chinese have done for the EU. US, on the other hand, have spilled blood to defend the contin…

Numbers for those 85% please, and include material deliveries as well, ok?

By now so, the meme of Germany funding Putin by virtue buying gas from Russia is as stale and old as the "they lied about masks" one. Old enough to just not adress anymore.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#114

Post by endisneigh »

Taywee wrote: post #67
konschubert wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The effect is going to be that all the innovation happens elsewhere, big AI companies will develop outside Europe. And Europeans will only get to benefit as consumers, not as makers of AI. And the EU will take that as a reason to regulate even harder and then also somehow end up giving a bunch of money to its telcos. EDIT: My point is that regulation doesn’t just prevent “bad products”. The compliance overhead also p…

Yeah, like food safety regulations, other places still won't abide. It's not like "other places still will allow abuse of their citizens" is a great argument for us to as well. Safety regulations exist in every major industry, and sometimes it slows some progress for the sake of individuals. This isn't a bad thing.

I don't know why people compare software regulation to the regulation of physical things that do obvious harm like food regulations.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#115

Post by Renaud »

melvinmelih wrote: post #85

There’s a reason why Google didn’t release Bard to EU yesterday, expect that to happen more and more as they fall further and further behind.

It’s ok.

Either Google manages to follow these principles, which to me look aligned to their announced intent for more ethical AI use, or they won’t, and that means their product won’t follow the basic ethical guidelines proposed by the EU, in which case, I’d rather it not be available in the EU (and I don’t understand how anyone would defend a company not ready to address these ethical concerns).

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#116

Post by dantheman »

sambeau wrote: post #39
jiggywiggy wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with this type of regulation is that you need to add huge amount of vagueness in the law to be future proof. Leading to huge amounts of uncertainty for companies, unnecessary red tape and higher legal fees. As well as giving the power to a judge to punish companies if the public sentiment goes negative.

Laws can be iterated on. Uncertainty, red tape and legal fees all seem like worth-while brakes on a potentially dangerous industry. Better to be safe than sorry.

How's the cookie banner going?

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#118

Post by btbuildem »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #56
wongarsu wrote: post #31

In general I find the EU AI act quite reasonable. There are a couple AI uses that will be prohibited (most mentioned by the article, mostly manipulating people or dystopian government stuff). But imho the meat of the act is in categorizing many use cases as "High Risk", which comes with a list of requirements. Things like putting some effort in thinking about risks, into your training data, understanding biases, havi…

The EU AI act is more for protecting people from being exploited by companies and institutions and having AI take the fall. Basically what they're trying to prevent, is that you can't deny someone welfare, or an insurance claim, or a close their bank account with the justification that "computer says NO"[1]. For every such decision, a human should be at the wheel who can bring a legal fitting justification and be res…

That seems like a very reasonable stance. AI is a tool like any other, the entities with agency that use it are still people.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#119

Post by localplume »

hef19898 wrote: post #82
lvl102 wrote: post #53

I quite frankly don’t care what EU does. They’ve not been innovating at all there. They took a bunch of Chinese money and now they’re doing everything they can to harm US tech firms…while the US is de facto defending them with own tax money in Ukraine. I cannot wait for EUZ to fail.

If those poor, under-priviledged US tech just a helping hand in defending themselves against those evil, democratic governments... Communism it is! /s On a more serious note, you are aware of the fact that a lot of the material and money Ukraine is gettong comes from European NATO countries and the EU? It is almost like an, whats the word again, alliance supporting Ukraine instead of a single country.

[dead]

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#120

Post by braveyellowtoad »

endisneigh wrote: post #114
Taywee wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, like food safety regulations, other places still won't abide. It's not like "other places still will allow abuse of their citizens" is a great argument for us to as well. Safety regulations exist in every major industry, and sometimes it slows some progress for the sake of individuals. This isn't a bad thing.

I don't know why people compare software regulation to the regulation of physical things that do obvious harm like food regulations.

Could you please clarify: is your position that software is not capable of doing harm?
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