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Framework Laptop 16

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Re: Framework Laptop 16

#111

Post by justin66 »

goosedragons wrote: post #68
Tsiklon wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

16:10 has been around and relatively popular for at least 17 years. The original 2006 MacBook Pro had a 16:10 1440x900 panel

16:10 goes ALL the way back to some of the earliest widescreen LCDs. The original Apple Cinema Display was 1600x1024 in 1999. This was predated by the SGI 1600SW with the same resolution in 1998.

The Matrox Millenium II supported 1920x1200 in 1997.

Manual for the Mac version, but the PC version has this resolution as well: https://www.matrox.com/sites/default/files/en_millennium_ii_...

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#112

Post by afavour »

dakial1 wrote: post #87

I wonder if there is a market for a framework gaming laptop. Really hope there is. Also, on another note, I've read this engadget article about how other companies tried to build an upgradeable laptop and failed but I see Framework as a different kind of beast for one simple reason. This is their only value proposition, they don't have an alternative. In a very "Innovator's Dilemma" kind of. way, Dell and other big m…

I’d be surprised if there was a market for a Framework laptop dedicated to gaming but I am really intrigued by a Framework laptop that can game.

I use my laptop for my work software engineering but since the pandemic have gotten back into gaming a little. I’m on an old Xbox and it’s showing its age but I don’t game enough to justify buying a whole gaming PC. If I can plug a GPU into my work machine and play some games? Now that’s compelling. The fact that it wouldn’t have all the cringey “gamer” decorations you see on the average gaming laptop would be a bonus too.

(all that said a Steam Deck is probably still the more compelling purchase for me in that regard, I’ve been eyeing one for a while)

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#113

Post by codedokode »

Aachen wrote: post #43
notRobot wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're wrong. It's a 16:10 screen. CEO: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35280523

Ugh. After over a decade of work, everything was finally adapted to or made for 16:9, now they're going after hipster ratios? Not a deal breaker but a bummer. Interesting that phones are going the other way, so now we can enjoy letterboxes on both platforms and not be able to reach the notification drawer. What was so wrong with 16:9 that we needed another competing standard that's just slightly off...

What 16:9 is good for? It is inconvenient for any work: for coding, reading articles or working with documents more height is better. Please explain for what kind of activity wide, but low height screen is the most suitable?

The only thing that comes to mind is killing time by watching videos on social networks sites.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#114

Post by codedokode »

rsynnott wrote: post #90
Aachen wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ugh. After over a decade of work, everything was finally adapted to or made for 16:9, now they're going after hipster ratios? Not a deal breaker but a bummer. Interesting that phones are going the other way, so now we can enjoy letterboxes on both platforms and not be able to reach the notification drawer. What was so wrong with 16:9 that we needed another competing standard that's just slightly off...

> now they're going after hipster ratios? Eh? 16:10 is a pretty standard ratio; all Apple laptops have used it since about 2007, for instance (until very recently, when they've gone a little taller) but also many other vendors (usually on the high end; for whatever reason manufacturers do tend to treat taller than 16:9 as a bit of a premium option). It was also effectively the standard ratio for widescreen desktop mo…

4:3 is definitely better for coding and working with documents because programs and documents usually span vertically, not horizontally. It is disappointing that manufacturers target people watching videos instead of people who do work.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#115

Post by tracker1 »

cduzz wrote: post #80
Leimi wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sadly I feel like trackpoints are really end of life and I wouldn't be surprised if Lenovo ditched them entirely soon. It seems they keep it only to please the tiny but vocal minority of tinkerers that we are. But we mostly buy old, second hand thinkpads. And as keyboards get thinner, trackpoints lose in quality. On linux it seems the software side is also not as good as before with libinput. So I'd be really surpris…

There's a trope in car nerd circles of "We all know the best vehicle is a manual transmission brown diesel station wagon" and then of course these people only buy one that's 10 years old, so at this point no car company makes such a beast new . Pre-covid I'd made do with whatever garbage keyboard and garbage monitor $job dumped in front of me, but almost by happenstance I ended up with a 16:10 monitor and an IBM M4-1…

I spent over a decade dealing with the mushy keyboards... my preference now is the M-style unicomp, which I use on my work computer... or I'll fall back to a Cherry mx brown switch keyboard, if there's complaints. I use one for my personal desktop too for backlighting.

There's nothing like the feel, and my RSI issues that I was starting to get improved greatly not bottoming out on a sponge for every key tap.

Unfortunately, switched keyboards for laptops are limited and don't have much travel... they do exist and are definitely superior though. Would be a cool option for framework, but not sure how well they fit for clearance, or what kind of switches framework's kb uses... I've been using an M1 air that I had bought before hearing about framework for personal use, but don't use it much... in a few years, will likely buy from framework and hope they're still around.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#116

Post by savef »

panick21_ wrote: post #104

One of my favorite things for keyboards is the ThinkPad feature where the Page Up and Page Down is above the Left and Right key. I don't understand why others don't do this, its so practical. Specially in cases like this, there is just an empty space there. Why not put 2 more keys? ThinkPad also makes them full sized keys, that would be even better. But just having empty space? Why?

Ha, that's an interesting take. My Dell work laptop has these (not full-sized) and I don't like them at all. There's nothing fun about trying to use the arrows and accidentally slipping onto a key that isn't usually there, which might scroll my cursor/window by a huge amount. My fingers expect no space there, so it makes the whole area less distinct to touch to have the spaces filled.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#117

Post by itronitron »

dakial1 wrote: post #87

I wonder if there is a market for a framework gaming laptop. Really hope there is. Also, on another note, I've read this engadget article about how other companies tried to build an upgradeable laptop and failed but I see Framework as a different kind of beast for one simple reason. This is their only value proposition, they don't have an alternative. In a very "Innovator's Dilemma" kind of. way, Dell and other big m…

>> I wonder if there is a market for a framework gaming laptop.

Yes, there is. We have four in our family, since ~2018, and three of them continue to run without issue. The main weak point for the 4th one has been the hinges and case. It happens to be a later model so I think the company 'value-engineered' it to have a shorter lifespan.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#118

Post by chrismorgan »

Macha wrote: post #75
column wrote: post #47

why did they butcher the Entry key instead of making the tab key narrower?

The laptop pictured has a US keyboard layout, that's just how the US keyboard layout is. They also have an ISO/most-of-world keyboard layout (with options for qwerty/qwertz/azerty labelling, at least on last gen), as seen on the laptop ad in the footer (assuming the link doesn't get changed from the french site after I post that comment, if it does, just go look up the order form on an EU site)

> ISO/most-of-world

I’m not certain, but I’m under the impression that the ANSI layout is more common than ISO: that, potentially simplifying a tad, ISO is used in Europe, JIS in Japan, and ANSI everywhere else. (I have experience in Australia, New Zealand, India and the United States, and they all use ANSI.)

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#119

Post by tracker1 »

hdhrufjdi wrote: post #96
Snuupy wrote: post #83

for the 16": - I would love an option to have upwards firing speakers where flex/numpad space goes instead (one on each side). - please improve the bass in the speakers. according to notebookcheck's review, framework speakers have poor/near 0 bass output. - please offer either a 1080p or 4k screen option on the 16". 1440p-ish screens with DPI scaling hackery is no fun and often leads to blurry UIs.

It's a software problem of the software you are using, and not a hardware problem.

Of course... that said, MANY software are dated and aren't or won't be implementing scaling any time soon. For those of us using Linux, it's even worse. This doesn't mean that the hardware shouldn't consider the existing software ecosystem. A 4k display with 2x scaling is often a good option for laptops.

My vision at computer distance isn't great in general, usually on a 32" 1440p display for desktop use. I generally can barely handle the micro size of higher res on laptops.

Re: Framework Laptop 16

#120

Post by chaxor »

panick21_ wrote: post #104

One of my favorite things for keyboards is the ThinkPad feature where the Page Up and Page Down is above the Left and Right key. I don't understand why others don't do this, its so practical. Specially in cases like this, there is just an empty space there. Why not put 2 more keys? ThinkPad also makes them full sized keys, that would be even better. But just having empty space? Why?

Vimium and vim (or even xmodmap if you like) are even more useful for this, since you don't have to have a special keyboard, and you can set it to whatever you like.
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