Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022 • Hacker News Board

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#111

Post by stronglikedan » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:30 PM UTC

isanengineer wrote: post #77

I worked in the solar industry for years and this is a very good summary of the residential install process from the customer side. I’ll also second one of the main points of the author: do NOT get a solar lease. Either finance it through a solar loan or pay cash. A good solar company will not push you into a lease. If they try, talk to someone else.

Also should be noted to get multiple estimates, even though that's kind of common sense. I had them vary wildly, where the most expensive one was literally twice as much as the cheapest one.

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#112

Post by wittycardio » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:30 PM UTC

frankfrankfrank wrote: post #27

swagasaurus-rex wrote: post #3

> The unsubsidized all-in price for buying and installing the panels was $25,525.43... after counting this $6,636.61 tax credit, the subsidized price was $18,888.82 Looks like a 7 year return on investment after subsidies, 10 years without.

That is technically true, but why is no one asking how and why his electricity bill is $223 at minimum, plied higher since the bill was only reduced by that amount. Also, “subsidies” are really just a quaint term for “made the working and lower middle class that can’t pay for such exorbitant luxuries pay for it through taxes and inflation”. I’m always a bit confused if seemingly otherwise smart people simply don’t un…

You are incredibly ignorant about how the world works.

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#113

Post by prettychill » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:30 PM UTC

kube-system wrote: post #68

prettychill wrote: post #5

I am surprised at these power bills, at least in my area the implied "savings" are 2-3 times what my bill is on any given month. Huge house maybe?

The electricity prices listed in the article are quite high, the US average is about half of that.

This is a great point. Avg cost for me last year was less than half, around 11c/kWh

Though, https://www.eia.gov/electricity/state/ makes me wonder how you are getting 25c/kWh prices, as author estimates. Maybe higher price tiers due to usage.

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#114

Post by LgWoodenBadger » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:31 PM UTC

csense wrote: post #4

Interesting to see a post about this from someone else who I'm assuming is in a northern climate (they say New England). One of my biggest questions about solar is, what happens when it snows? Do you have to get up on the roof and clean them off by hand? Or do they have built-in defrosters?

I had them when I lived in Pennsylvania. The panels self-clear in a literal avalanche that destroyed all the bushes where it landed. It sounds like a freight train in your attic when it happens.

Had someone been standing underneath when it happens they would have been seriously injured.

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#115

Post by _whiteCaps_ » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:31 PM UTC

0cf8612b2e1e wrote: post #12

prettychill wrote: post #5

I am surprised at these power bills, at least in my area the implied "savings" are 2-3 times what my bill is on any given month. Huge house maybe?

That was not takeaway as well -this person seemingly lives on an estate. I do not think most roofs even have the space for 21 panels.

If my math is right, 21 panels is 38.2 m^2 or 411 ft^2. That's not a huge amount of roof space. Depends on the roof pitch, but I think it could cover just the south facing sides of a roof of a 2000 ft^2 home.

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#116

Post by RC_ITR » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:32 PM UTC

frankfrankfrank wrote: post #27

swagasaurus-rex wrote: post #3

> The unsubsidized all-in price for buying and installing the panels was $25,525.43... after counting this $6,636.61 tax credit, the subsidized price was $18,888.82 Looks like a 7 year return on investment after subsidies, 10 years without.

That is technically true, but why is no one asking how and why his electricity bill is $223 at minimum, plied higher since the bill was only reduced by that amount. Also, “subsidies” are really just a quaint term for “made the working and lower middle class that can’t pay for such exorbitant luxuries pay for it through taxes and inflation”. I’m always a bit confused if seemingly otherwise smart people simply don’t un…

>Would anyone like to subsidize my next restaurant visit by paying for my entree? No? But making someone unknown working class person pay for my $25,000 solar install through inflation is ok?

It's amazing how ignorant people can be to the world around them. Let's assume you live in the US, since the article is dealing with those subsidies.

The food you're eating - c. 20% of US farm income is subsidies [0]

The employees of the restaurant - probably, at least one of them is on a government support program to augment their wages [1]

The car you drove to the restaurant in - the US Federal government subsidized your gas (ever wonder why US gas is cheaper than Canada/EU?) [2]

So maybe instead of spending your time looking down your nose and 'not understanding why people don't understand economics,' why don't you do research on the world around you?

[0] https://perc.tamu.edu/PERC-Blog/PERC-Blog/U-S-Farm-Subsidies...

[1] https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-21-45

[2] https://www.eesi.org/papers/view/fact-sheet-fossil-fuel-subs...

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#117

Post by matwood » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:32 PM UTC

pkulak wrote: post #62

jjeaff wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Especially considering most modern panels are expected to still have a good amount of life left in them after 25 years. (80% or more}

AND considering that replacing only the panels has to be far cheaper than the initial installation, if they do drop too much in 25 years. So long as your roof is still okay, I suppose.

Just bake new panels into the cost of a new roof. It's probably time for both after 25 years.

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#118

Post by pizza234 » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:33 PM UTC

maerF0x0 wrote: post #87

>Realizing that the solar company was in quite the pickle insofar as repossessing the panels would require costly legal actions on top of paying people to take out the system, I just waited on the payment. They would contact me periodically asking me to make payment and offering to help me get approved for a new loan. But I just ignored all of that. Seems pretty unethical tbh. The solar company delivered, but now thi…

Based on his explanation, the company has at least some level of fault:

> my non-payment would not be a default because default is defined by a breach of contract and no such contract existed. Indeed, if anyone breached the contract, it was the solar company by not installing in the six-month period.

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#119

Post by ShakataGaNai » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:33 PM UTC

koolba wrote: post #75

ShakataGaNai wrote: post #22

My system generated 14.36 MWh in 2022, which comes out to roughly $4,308 USD. The ROI is about 5-6 years for the system itself. But a new roof was also in order.... so more like 10-12 years. Still a great deal if you can afford to invest for the long term. Especially with a 30 year warranty on most of the equipment.

> Especially with a 30 year warranty on most of the equipment. Warranted by who exactly? A 30-year warranty from a company that’s been in existence for 2-3 years doesn’t quite have the same weight.

Warrantied by the installer, whom has been around for more than 30 years. Also warrantied by the OEM. Which is small names like "Panasonic".

Re: Solar panels reduced my electric bill in 2022

#120

Post by VintageLight » Tue, Jan 03, 2023, 6:34 PM UTC

jefftk wrote: post #35

0cf8612b2e1e wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was not takeaway as well -this person seemingly lives on an estate. I do not think most roofs even have the space for 21 panels.

Having 21 panels requires a rectangle 17ft by 24ft (each panel is 5.4ft by 3.25ft). That's far from an estate: if it's a two story home with a flat roof you're talking 816sqft compared to a US median of 2,300sqft.

1. Most roofs aren't flat. 2. For pitched roofs, you're only going to want to install on the south or west facing sides. So only some percentage of your roof area is ideal.