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Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

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Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#111

Post by bogdangrigg »

tinyhouse wrote: post #66
GoToRO wrote: post #28

It's always something toxic when it comes to US companies. I had to do multiple background checks. In Romania they are unheard of.

Funny. Most US companies behave much better than companies outside the US. That's why Romanians looking to be hired by US companies and not vice versa (no attempt to offend you or any other Romanian, just stating a fact). This company sounds like a shitty one, the US of course has those like any other country, but it's usually the US ones that get more publicity when things like this happen.(also when good things hap…

If by "behave better" you mean "pay more"... it's probably be correct.

But when comparing overall US & EU working conditions, it's a very lopsided contest. US employees seem to be abused by European standards: at-will employment, no maternity leave, workplace surveillance, unpaid overtime for salaried employees are illegal pretty much everywhere - even Romania.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#112

Post by myko »

xiphias2 wrote: post #107
sebazzz wrote: post #36

I love it when US companies meet Dutch labor laws.

While quality of life in Europe is still great, EU GDP share of the world going down is starting to effect European people more (especially now with the proxy war between US and Russia). I wish Europeans were a bit more business savy and corporate, and not see businesses as just bad things that are part of life, but of course when I’m in US I see the other extreme where businesses want to extract all value from me al…

> especially now with the proxy war between US and Russia

This is not a proxy war between the US and Russia. Ukraine nor Russia started this conflict at the behest or instigation of the US. The US (and NATO, the entire western world really) are supportive of Ukraine but it's important to note that Ukraine is not a puppet of the US and that Putin started this conflict.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#113

Post by lucb1e »

6stringmerc wrote: post #16
yosamino wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not true that in Austria you can be terminated for any reason at all. There are protections in place. For example, in the regular case, i.e. 'no urgent reason' there is no such thing as an immediate dismissal, and this can be fought. Of course as always with the law ymmv - but there are many different ways in which your rights as a worker are protected. See this: https://www.usp.gv.at/mitarbeiter/beendigung-arbeitsve…

Very similar in Texas - it is called At Will employment. Other states are Right to Work. Each has pros and cons. I’ve only lived and worked in Texas so At Will is very close to “for any reason” as long as it’s not against the law. Don’t like your haircut? They can shut can you on the spot. On the flip side, if one day you go in and you’ve just had enough of the hourly retail job and think you can get a better one, yo…

> Usually we flash the double V for Victory sign and say “Peace out!” when that’s the case. It’s fun.

Sounds like a good way to burn bridges. If I'd show up to work one day and tell them to suck it up for the next few months of planned projects, I do know what kind of reference my boss would provide to future employers.

It's not about loyalty or something, but so long as there isn't anything egregious, it does seem reasonable to me that both sides can expect a notice periods.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#114

Post by brabel »

xiphias2 wrote: post #107
sebazzz wrote: post #36

I love it when US companies meet Dutch labor laws.

While quality of life in Europe is still great, EU GDP share of the world going down is starting to effect European people more (especially now with the proxy war between US and Russia). I wish Europeans were a bit more business savy and corporate, and not see businesses as just bad things that are part of life, but of course when I’m in US I see the other extreme where businesses want to extract all value from me al…

Quite honestly, if anything, I think we (and I truly mean nearly everyone here) in the EU have far more than necessary to have a decent life and doing anything more "business savy" would not have any positive effect on our lives at all. Yes, maybe we could make a little bit more money by being more business crazy, but what's the point if you get nothing you actually desire in return?

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#115

Post by em-bee »

isbvhodnvemrwvn wrote: post #108
em-bee wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and give them at least one month notice as well as pay out their unused holidays.

Not really, mutual agreements are a thing. If you pay someone with one month notice 3 months worth of pay to leave on the same day, they would be stupid not to take it.

ok, yeah, as long as you pay more than the remaining working time. but an employee has to watch out how that affects unemployment benefits.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#116

Post by trasz »

myko wrote: post #112
xiphias2 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While quality of life in Europe is still great, EU GDP share of the world going down is starting to effect European people more (especially now with the proxy war between US and Russia). I wish Europeans were a bit more business savy and corporate, and not see businesses as just bad things that are part of life, but of course when I’m in US I see the other extreme where businesses want to extract all value from me al…

> especially now with the proxy war between US and Russia This is not a proxy war between the US and Russia. Ukraine nor Russia started this conflict at the behest or instigation of the US. The US (and NATO, the entire western world really) are supportive of Ukraine but it's important to note that Ukraine is not a puppet of the US and that Putin started this conflict.

It could be argued it’s a proxy war between NATO and some… unknown world power, with Russia as a proxy. Although I don’t think Chinese would be able to pull it off.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#117

Post by lucb1e »

Etheryte wrote: post #61
the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that it’s only the notice period that this considers. The Netherlands and Austria are the same in that you can terminate an employee without reason. //edit: apparently that’s incorrect for the Netherlands. Must have mixed that up.

This is not true at all. It's notoriously hard to fire someone in the Netherlands.

I've always wondered about this.

In my contract, it says there is a few months' notice period, both when I want to stop working there as well as when they want me to stop working there. When reviewing the contract, it sounded reasonable and I just assumed that when I get the notice, that's how it is.

Later, I learned of these "there must be a valid reason" type of protections.

Does that make this whole clause void? Or even working in my favor, that is: even if there is a valid reason, our contract adds those months of notice period?

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#118

Post by maartenscholl »

tick_tock_tick wrote: post #100
maartenscholl wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you'd read the second sentence of the article, you would have learned that the company has a branch in the Netherlands.

And if you kept reading you'd know they don't anymore and the guy hasn't been paid.

I read that and I don't think it contradicts my comment, as the firm had the Dutch entity and thus the knowledge of Dutch labour laws at the time of the firing. This is contrary to what the parent supposes.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#119

Post by matthewheath »

Archelaos wrote: post #34
V__ wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking at their website [1] they still have a location (branch?) in the UK. I don't know how Brexit changed the legal frameworks between the UK and EU, but I would assume that could be a avenue to get some enforcement. [1] https://www.chetu.com/locations.php

The UK (together with Denmark) was never part of the European Account Preservation Order, established in 2017. So the comparatively easy EU process to freez funds in another EU country was never possible there. What is possible according to UK law, I do not know.

It is possible to get a freezing order through the courts to freeze assets like land, property, bank accounts, etc.

It operates similarly to the European Account Preservation Order, and under the right circumstances it is possible to apply for a freezing order on a _without notice_ basis meaning that the employer would not be aware of the order until it is issued.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#120

Post by whoooooo123 »

myko wrote: post #112
xiphias2 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While quality of life in Europe is still great, EU GDP share of the world going down is starting to effect European people more (especially now with the proxy war between US and Russia). I wish Europeans were a bit more business savy and corporate, and not see businesses as just bad things that are part of life, but of course when I’m in US I see the other extreme where businesses want to extract all value from me al…

> especially now with the proxy war between US and Russia This is not a proxy war between the US and Russia. Ukraine nor Russia started this conflict at the behest or instigation of the US. The US (and NATO, the entire western world really) are supportive of Ukraine but it's important to note that Ukraine is not a puppet of the US and that Putin started this conflict.

The war is "between" Russia and Ukraine but the US is funding and arming Ukraine because the US wants to hurt Russia. How is that not the dictionary definition of a "proxy war"?

Swap the US and Russia and replace "Ukraine" with "North Vietnam" and you have a historical conflict which everyone agrees was a proxy war. How is this different?

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