I did this for roughly the first 25 years of my life. I no longer think it is a good idea. People invariably end up asking for money.
Don't ignore the janitor
111–120 of 286 posts
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#112Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Further, try to abide by their requests. If they want the trash can by the door to your office or cubicle on Thursday evening, move the damn trashcan to the door. Better yet, take your damn trashcan out to the damn dumpster your own damn self. Then we can save some damn money and fire the damn janitor. > They have 100 to empty; it's a trivial task for you. It's a trivial part of their job. They're getting paid for…
In Japanese schools, the kids are the ones doing the cleaning. Not just taking out the trash, but cleaning the blackboards, mopping the floor, tidying up the desks, cleaning the bathrooms, etc. The reasoning isn't to save money, however. It is precisely to teach them there's no such thing as work that is beneath them.
In the American version, Gingrich wanted just the poor kids to work as janitors in schools.
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#113As someone who worked as a high school kid for several weeks wiping the streets, I think post is complete bs.
At first, when I enrolled into this job 7 to 3, to keep a designated govt area clean, I was fascinated with the fact I clock at 3 PM. This gig was to earn extra $$ for my upcoming trip.
First day was entertaining as I do believe making things clean and in order is rewarding. But after a week of shoving the broom, I understood a few concepts: no matter how hard you fight the dust, sand, leaves on the street — next day will bring you the same. On top of it, humans litter. And they litter a lot. On top of it, the area had a pond. And we used to get a boat with the old-timer working there in his retirement and fish out plastic bags, glass bottles from the bottom of the pond. It was disgusting at what people do to the nature at this leisure area they have...
The only thing this job taught me is to throw the garbage into a bin, and if I miss — pick it up and put it back myself. And the next second thing, is that this job teaches you to be humble and disciplined. As it reduces your potential to one of the most primitive functions a human being can perform for money.
Given this, the condescending tone that is deemed as nice by the small-talk initiator — is plain hypocrisy to make him feel like a good person and show off with the blog post we have right now.
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#114This seems harder in our modern world where everything is contracted out to the lowest bidder. I've had great conversations with custodial staff at schools, parks, and other areas that actually hire the workers. At my day job, a giant corporation which hires its engineers but outsources its janitors, chefs, and so on, there's a totally different vibe. Even the few janitors that speak English are both rushed to comple…
One of the janitors in my high school once gave us a lecture on linear algebra. I don't know what he did before he left the former Warsaw Pact country he was from, but it was one of those whoa kind of experiences.
In the 1990s, when the former USSR had gone to shit, you could meet a lot of menial workers from the ex-Soviet republics who had academic degrees and could hold a conversation to prove it.
I studied mathematics in Prague in 1996-2003. More than once I met a janitor or a taxi driver who, albeit with a heavy Russian or Ukrainian accent, knew what a uniformly continuous function was and what does the Chinese Remainder Theorem say.
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#115Further, try to abide by their requests. If they want the trash can by the door to your office or cubicle on Thursday evening, move the damn trashcan to the door. They have 100 to empty; it's a trivial task for you. We can get wound up in ourselves and forget to hold a door, or avoid spilling crumbs on our carpet, or log out of our workstation, or use a different hallway when the floor is being waxed, or to move the…
I do get being nice to janitors--and I am happy to help them with something if asked, and I don't "ignore" them as noted in this article as I definitely agree that's rude to treat them as second-class humans unworthy of being regarded with eye contact or banter--but I am being paid to do my job and they are being paid to their job and if I am spending my time or mental energy doing part of their job then I feel like…
I don't know about other people but I go through my life trying to make things easier for other people, or failing that at least not make things harder, in the hope that someone else will do the same for me.
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#116Grandma may have been a kindred spirit of Vonnegut.
“God dammit, you’ve got to be kind.”
This quote, and idea, has stuck to me more than any I’ve ever read. Be kind, because… well, why not?
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#117Further, try to abide by their requests. If they want the trash can by the door to your office or cubicle on Thursday evening, move the damn trashcan to the door. They have 100 to empty; it's a trivial task for you. We can get wound up in ourselves and forget to hold a door, or avoid spilling crumbs on our carpet, or log out of our workstation, or use a different hallway when the floor is being waxed, or to move the…
I do get being nice to janitors--and I am happy to help them with something if asked, and I don't "ignore" them as noted in this article as I definitely agree that's rude to treat them as second-class humans unworthy of being regarded with eye contact or banter--but I am being paid to do my job and they are being paid to their job and if I am spending my time or mental energy doing part of their job then I feel like…
I bet you don't clear your table at McDonalds either :p
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#118When I was at the Cambridge office of Google, I liked to work until late. When the lights went out and the open space went quiet, finally I could get in the flow.
The cleaners were coming in after dinner. Many of them were Latin Americans, so I could engage in simple conversations to keep my Spanish fresh. A man from the Dominican Republic told me that previously he was a "periodista", a journalist, but his education wasn't applicable in the United States because he barely spoke English.
English literacy can be a huge economic advantage even in non-English speaking countries. My doctor in Tokyo could make a higher salary than ordinary Japanese doctors with the same qualifications, simply for working in an international clinic. Same goes for teachers in international schools. Many multinational companies which require English in their branch offices will pay higher than average salaries for engineers, sales and management.
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#119Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's not all that different than going home and doing the cooking or the laundry. Surely you don't leave housework to your partner "because your time would be better spent elsewhere", right? We don't think of brushing our teeth as "wading into the weeds", it's just an integral part of life for us. Cooking and laundry is (hopefully) just as much an integral part of life. Similarly, the Japanese famously don't have pub…
If I had the money I would pay for a cleaner in my house, for sure. I value cleanliness and relationships enough that of course I will do chores myself absent a cleaner, but I have no illusion that I am not trading my time and that my time would not be better spent doing other things.
> I have no illusion that I am not trading my time
I think that's kinda the point of the article. The people that ignore janitors surely are under no illusion that their time is better spent elsewhere than talking to cleaning staff. Rich parents in Dubai surely are under no illusion that it is better to hire full time nannies than to waste their time raising their own kids. The people in Wall-E surely are under no illusion that their time is better spent entertaining themselves than, well, anything.
But as the increasingly absurd examples hopefully illustrate, not everyone thinks the same way. For example, my wife firmly believes that food that is paid for is intrinsically inferior, because, all else being equal, it's not made with the same level of care as if it was made by family (and this in fact can be a particularly noticeable observation if you come from a culture that takes pride in elaborate cuisine)
We all have things that we believe implicitly are a waste of our time, perhaps because of our upbringing or some other reason, but I think the overarching message of the article is that there are some things in life that we should not be compromising on, even if we did have all the money in the world.
Re: Don't ignore the janitor
#120This is the kind of content that could've been at LinkedIn for /r/LinkedInLunatics to drool over. The only thing that's missing is the vertical line spacing. Why is this on top of HN? "Mind blown, I just learned about the concept of treating people nicely regardless of their job"?
> Why is this on top of HN? "Mind blown, I just learned about the concept of treating people nicely regardless of their job"? I don't see anything wrong with the post. Treating nicely can surely be extended to its author as well.
I agree, treat OP nicely. Also, I'll use this opportunity to quote the great philosopher Scooter "It's nice to be important, but it is more important to be nice!"