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The Deported

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Re: The Deported

#111

Post by m00dy »

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #110
m00dy wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>So it is true? Asking the same thing again and again doesn't help here. Unfortunately binary statements would not be sufficient to cover all parameters in this context. I hope this helps.

I don't understand what is the problem with "binary statements". Either Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians, etc, were brutally massacred by the Ottomans, or they were not. It shouldn't be that hard to say either "yes" or "no". If there are other issues to discuss, these can be addressed separately. But a simple true/false judgement should be very, very easy to decide given the wealth of historical information available.

According to the wealth of historical information available, I can find at least two turkish people that were brutally massacred by Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians etc. So yes, Ottomans were brutally massacred.

Re: The Deported

#112

Post by amq »

f6v wrote: post #103
yywwbbn wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an nonsensical comparison. As absurd as Putins claim is historically it has more ground to stand on , at least historically both Russia and Ukraine are (kind of) successors to the original Rus state centered around Kiev. Whereas Azerbaijan’s claim is basically based on the fact that they invaded the region and murdered or drove off the Armenians living there. Obviously what happened hundreds of years ago shou…

So Crimea had every right to declare independence from Ukraine?

Except, it didn't. The 'referendum' was a farce.

Re: The Deported

#113

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

m00dy wrote: post #111
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what is the problem with "binary statements". Either Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians, etc, were brutally massacred by the Ottomans, or they were not. It shouldn't be that hard to say either "yes" or "no". If there are other issues to discuss, these can be addressed separately. But a simple true/false judgement should be very, very easy to decide given the wealth of historical information available.

According to the wealth of historical information available, I can find at least two turkish people that were brutally massacred by Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians etc. So yes, Ottomans were brutally massacred.

And Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians and others were also brutally massacred, correct?

Kardas, let me be frank: we can play this game forever and you're not going to convince anyone you're right, you'll just convince everyone you're dishonest.

Re: The Deported

#114

Post by m00dy »

m00dy wrote: post #111
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what is the problem with "binary statements". Either Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians, etc, were brutally massacred by the Ottomans, or they were not. It shouldn't be that hard to say either "yes" or "no". If there are other issues to discuss, these can be addressed separately. But a simple true/false judgement should be very, very easy to decide given the wealth of historical information available.

According to the wealth of historical information available, I can find at least two turkish people that were brutally massacred by Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians etc. So yes, Ottomans were brutally massacred.

>>And Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians and others were also brutally massacred, correct? Kardas, let me be frank: we can play this game forever and you're not going to convince anyone you're right, you'll just convince everyone you're dishonest.

well, I'm not trying to convince anyone as I'm trying to make it clear that It is not making sense to be accused of something that we have never ever committed.

Re: The Deported

#115

Post by selimthegrim »

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #89
m00dy wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

The Turks fight like real men when they're up against women and children, old people and unarmed civilians. Like lions they fight then! What bravery, what heroism! When they're fighting someone like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodoros_Kolokotronis They turn tail and run screaming for mommy. "Real men"...

Is this the same guy the sacked Nafplion because he didn’t like who his son’s widow took up with, leaving Tripolitsa aside?

Re: The Deported

#116

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

m00dy wrote: post #114
m00dy wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to the wealth of historical information available, I can find at least two turkish people that were brutally massacred by Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians etc. So yes, Ottomans were brutally massacred.

>>And Greeks, Bulgarians, Armenians and others were also brutally massacred, correct? Kardas, let me be frank: we can play this game forever and you're not going to convince anyone you're right, you'll just convince everyone you're dishonest. well, I'm not trying to convince anyone as I'm trying to make it clear that It is not making sense to be accused of something that we have never ever committed.

Never ever, except for all the times that everybody knows about like Constantinople, Chios, Psarra, Crete, Armenia, Pontiac Greece, Smyrna and the rest of Asia Minor etc etc etc.

The Armenian genocide[a] was the systematic destruction of the Armenian people and identity in the Ottoman Empire during World War I. Spearheaded by the ruling Committee of Union and Progress (CUP), it was implemented primarily through the mass murder of around one million Armenians during death marches to the Syrian Desert and the forced Islamization of Armenian women and children.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_genocide

Other than that, never ever.

Re: The Deported

#117

Post by [deleted] »

selimthegrim wrote: post #115
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Turks fight like real men when they're up against women and children, old people and unarmed civilians. Like lions they fight then! What bravery, what heroism! When they're fighting someone like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodoros_Kolokotronis They turn tail and run screaming for mommy. "Real men"...

Is this the same guy the sacked Nafplion because he didn’t like who his son’s widow took up with, leaving Tripolitsa aside?

[deleted]

Re: The Deported

#118

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

selimthegrim wrote: post #115
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Turks fight like real men when they're up against women and children, old people and unarmed civilians. Like lions they fight then! What bravery, what heroism! When they're fighting someone like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodoros_Kolokotronis They turn tail and run screaming for mommy. "Real men"...

Is this the same guy the sacked Nafplion because he didn’t like who his son’s widow took up with, leaving Tripolitsa aside?

I'm sorry but I have no idea what episode you're referring to. Kolokotronis liberated Tripolitsa, then marched on Nafplio and ran over the force of Dramali pasha at Dervenakia.

Re: The Deported

#119

Post by selimthegrim »

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #118
selimthegrim wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this the same guy the sacked Nafplion because he didn’t like who his son’s widow took up with, leaving Tripolitsa aside?

I'm sorry but I have no idea what episode you're referring to. Kolokotronis liberated Tripolitsa, then marched on Nafplio and ran over the force of Dramali pasha at Dervenakia.

See page 204, Mazower, The Greek Revolution, 1821 and the making of modern Europe. Panos Kolokotronis’ widow took up with Grivas which (among other things) set off fighting with the Rumeliotes (which the book details in other places, not sparing Grivas either)

NB: I didn't mean that he turned aside from Tripolitsa, I meant I was leaving the subject aside.

Re: The Deported

#120

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

selimthegrim wrote: post #119
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry but I have no idea what episode you're referring to. Kolokotronis liberated Tripolitsa, then marched on Nafplio and ran over the force of Dramali pasha at Dervenakia.

See page 204, Mazower, The Greek Revolution, 1821 and the making of modern Europe . Panos Kolokotronis’ widow took up with Grivas which (among other things) set off fighting with the Rumeliotes (which the book details in other places, not sparing Grivas either) NB: I didn't mean that he turned aside from Tripolitsa, I meant I was leaving the subject aside.

You'll have to forgive me, but I don't have Mazower at hand. In any case, I don't know the episode you're referring to but the constant strife in the Greek ranks during the Revolution is well known. It doesn't change the fact that Kolokotronis dealt a serious blow to the might of the Empire at Dervenakia.

It also doesn't change the ridiculousness of the expression "real men" used by the OP particularly in the context in which it was used.

Btw, "selimthegrim", hm? I guess we all have our national heroes... Too bad that they usually killed each other.

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