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Myths about Social Media

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Re: Myths about Social Media

#111
At this link there is the article where M.B. Petersen (and collaborator) gives a more precise notion of the question behind Myth 2 ("Does social media make people hateful?") https://psyarxiv.com/hwb83/

I haven't formed an opinion yet, but I'd be curious to hear from anybody who has one. (see among other things how they test for a "hostility gap", page 16).

[edit: "more hateful" -> "hateful"]

Re: Myths about Social Media

#112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it not bigoted and hateful to say that someone should die because they didn’t get the vaccine? Asking as a liberal

Not taking a vaccine and endangering yourself and others as a result is a personal choice, so I would not call it "bigoted" to be angry at someone for making that choice. "Hateful", maybe. But again, it is personal choice that person made that endangers others. It is also not an active stance - no "liberal" is going out to actively make unvaccinated people die. They are just sitting there hoping for their choices to…

Bigoted literally means close-minded.

I have encountered many close-minded liberal opinions.

Think about this: we have seen ideas on the right that go too far (e.g., storming the capitol, white nationalism, racism or other forms of hateful discrimination). But there are ideas on the left that go too far also.

Who is keeping check on the other end? Can liberal or left-leaning ideas go to far? When they do, are they being criticized publicly or excuses/ignored? If that’s not happening then bigotry will become rampant.

Re: Myths about Social Media

#113

At this link there is the article where M.B. Petersen (and collaborator) gives a more precise notion of the question behind Myth 2 ("Does social media make people hateful?") https://psyarxiv.com/hwb83/ I haven't formed an opinion yet, but I'd be curious to hear from anybody who has one. (see among other things how they test for a "hostility gap", page 16). [edit: "more hateful" -> "hateful"]

I haven’t been on social media for years but maintain a minimal LinkedIn for professional purposes. To me, it seems a great choice I made years ago. There’s too much life to live and not enough time to let randos on the Internet into your time. Increasingly, I see people unable to disconnect from social media. Whatever happens there seems immediately wired into their brain (and by their choice to some extent).

Edit-If something makes you feel consistently bad or worse about yourself then tuning out or disconnecting from it is a sane choice. Even murderers can lead meaningful lives behind bars. (Dostoevsky was good for this insight)

Re: Myths about Social Media

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't get to embrace bigotry and hatred, and then turn around and complain when you get kicked out. If the conservative subreddits could have managed to behave themselves like rational and good people, they would not be getting kicked out.

Is it not bigoted and hateful to say that someone should die because they didn’t get the vaccine? Asking as a liberal

Answer as a liberal: yes, it is bigoted and hateful.

You'll see people from both sides doing all sorts of pirouettes to justify why when the others do it it's bad, but when they do something similar it's justified, or they'll point out to other stuff to deflect the criticism. In any sufficiently large group of people you'll always find people who are not good at admitting mistakes or doing any self reflection, that goes for conservatives, liberals, socialists, fascists... You can argue it's to different extents, but all have plenty of it.

My experience with social media is that it tends to amplify the stuff that's most reactionary, causing it to spread until the fastest growing one takes over, kind of like a mould on stale bread. The analogy kind of works for new websites too, as it seems new social media is often more enjoyable and it takes some time for toxicity to start seeping in.

Re: Myths about Social Media

#115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not talking about obvious (and easily labeled morons), but instead there are many educated and real scientists that raise questions and there is no dialogue, but instead only defunct-fact checkers totalitarian response. Science is always open to listen, discuss and stand open to be corrected and in no time in history there was "attack on me is attack on science" attitudes that ended up be right or productive. It…

What kind of reasoned, introspective dialogue do you think you're going to have 140 characters at a time?

It's 280 now, but the point is the same: The system has been engineered from the ground up to create an environment that ENcourages insipid repetition, and actively DIScourages insightful discourse. I fear this will somehow get worse with Jack's departure.

Re: Myths about Social Media

#116
I agree with a lot of that. In my opinion, the problem is the news feed. My very "hot take" is that social media does not only NOT create echo chambers, it's actually the opposite problem.

People naturally self-organize according to common interests and values. Prior to "modern social media", forums were popular and each forum was special-interest and broken into sub-forums. There was usually the obligatory "Off Topic" forum where anything goes (and you'd still have organized threads) and often the "Only Religious" thread and "Only Politics" thread. People would venture into those threads knowing exactly what to expect, and they could bail out at any time. Some of those threads got heated, but I don't remember people saying Forums were causing a mental health crises or that people were being censored because mods deleted off-topic or obscene content.

Social media like Twatter and Facebook introduced the "news feed" where everything and anything gets shoved down your throat and you have no ability to filter by content or topic. The best you can do is follow / un-follow or mute certain pages or friends. I don't know anyone who doesn't want a chronological sort option, but "the algorithm" wants to push the most engaged with content to the topic. And we all know that the most engaged with content tends to be the most incendiary and provoking.

Don't get me wrong, exposing yourself to "uncomfortable" information and challenging your beliefs is healthy and everyone should do it from time to time for self-growth. But the vast majority of people who go on Twatter of Facebook are looking for entertainment, not rational discourse. They log on after a hard day at work looking to unwind with cute cat gifs and instead get their crazy uncle's political rantings shoved down their throats or, far worse, some clickbait news headline that makes everyone of all political stripes want to click because it's so stupid and provocative.

It's no wonder people seem more angry on social media.

Re: Myths about Social Media

#117
post #53

What is the lens here? If it's Danish lens, then I'm concerned it doesn't fully capture what's happening in other markets. > Myth 1: A lot of misinfo on social media... No, research suggests there is little, shared by few & having small effects. The U.S. anti-vax group is quite vocal and quite large. At times this includes elected officials, but sometimes elected officials simply resist mandates which emboldens vacci…

> The U.S. anti-vax group is quite vocal and quite large. Yes, here [1] is an example of a pro-vax comment, made by a flaired user, removed from r/conservative. The user was probably not notified of the removal, and the comment appears to its author as if it was not removed. To me, that is very misleading. I consider such removals a form of misinformation; other users only see a version of the discussion that is whol…

Great mirror to the comment one thread up selling /r/conservative as an example of most reasonable right-leaning people jsut discussing and getting unfairly hated by the rest of Reddit.

Re: Myths about Social Media

#118
post #88

It's incredibly weird to me that people are ok with demonizing feelings and tone. Who cares if people are 'hateful'? One man's hate is another slight aggresion, and american toxic positivity makes haters of us all even if we speak with the best of intentions.

Hate is toxic because it excludes people who cannot handle hate from discussion and closes their possibility for self expression.

You don't want discussion to be only available for people with 'thick skin' because that is like 'only the strongest are allowed to eat'.

I think as a society we are well past that.

The opposite toxic behavior is of course labeling every disagreement as 'hateful'.

Feelings and tone should be used appropriately.

If someone writes that 'my candidate' is bad I am not going to swear and scream all caps.

If someone is standing with his phone and filming car crash instead of helping he is going to get couple juicy words from me.

Re: Myths about Social Media

#119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not taking a vaccine and endangering yourself and others as a result is a personal choice, so I would not call it "bigoted" to be angry at someone for making that choice. "Hateful", maybe. But again, it is personal choice that person made that endangers others. It is also not an active stance - no "liberal" is going out to actively make unvaccinated people die. They are just sitting there hoping for their choices to…

Bigoted literally means close-minded. I have encountered many close-minded liberal opinions. Think about this: we have seen ideas on the right that go too far (e.g., storming the capitol, white nationalism, racism or other forms of hateful discrimination). But there are ideas on the left that go too far also. Who is keeping check on the other end? Can liberal or left-leaning ideas go to far? When they do, are they be…

There are no widely accepted ideas on the left that go anywhere near as "too far" as there are on the right. There simply is no comparison there.

There certainly could be such ideas. But right now, as things stand? No, there aren't anything like the absolute madness the right is displaying. Nowhere near.

Re: Myths about Social Media

#120
post #12

Maybe it would be worth repeating the 'myths' he lists in the tweets: Myth 1: A lot of misinfo on social media No, research suggests there is little, shared by few & having small effects. Those sharing misinfo are not dumb. But they have intense political animus, which motivates to share what fits their worldview, true or false. Myth 2: Social media makes people hateful No, research suggests that online hate reflects…

I would love to read the research he's referring to, but I couldn't find any links or citations. I intuitively believe that there's truth to all of these so called myths, but I'd love to be proven wrong. Anyone know where I can read more about this?

> I intuitively believe that there's truth to all of these so called myths, but I'd love to be proven wrong.

His opinions are based on claimed research while yours are based on intuition. I’d sooner trust his opionions compared to yours because he at least could be exposed as a liar if it turns out that the research doesn’t back up his opinions. You on the other hand would at worst be called naive.

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