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Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

woob.tech

111–120 of 124 posts

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#111
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha, I'm trying to start a data ownership forum now. My approach has been to have it be a central place for support for all my open source projects. We'll see how that works out.

> data ownership forum Care to share or explain more? Sounds awesome.

That's pretty much the whole tweet! Feel free to join us:

https://forum.indiebits.io/

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#112
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not “political correctness” which killed the humor, in fact the humor was there by accident and at the beginning the creator of the project found that funny, so it stuck for a while > When weboob was started in 2010, 11 years ago, the name was chosen, without a hidden agenda, since as a French speaker, "boob" wasn't part of my vocabulary. > Following its release and the ensuing reactions, during its first years,…

> since as a French speaker, "boob" wasn't part of my vocabulary. I think this sentence has been carefully constructed to be kind of true. The original author certainly knew what "boob" mean at the time. And the name "weboob" was voluntarily chosen as a pun. Now if you ask him maybe he will deny (I have other memories, but who cares) or maybe he will simply say that we do not use "boob" on a day to day basis in frenc…

> I think this sentence has been carefully constructed to be kind of true. The original author certainly knew what "boob" mean at the time.

Maybe, but not certainly. Do not assume too much English proficiency in France in 2010. It has changed a lot in the past decade, with most of the French hacker spaces disappearing or fusing in the global internet, but I still remember the 2000s, when we were hanging around in French IRC channels or forums.

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#113
post #102

Something I've been thinking about lately is how browsers have essentially become a dependency for any sort of auth on the internet. Pretty much everything uses OAuth2, which requires you to be able to render HTML and CSS, and in many implementations JavaScript. That's ~20M (Firefox) to ~30M (Chromium) lines of code as a dependency for your application, just for auth. This applies even if you have a slick CLI app lik…

Why stop at browsers, the OS is a dependency for your app too

Essential vs accidental complexity.

Most content on the web is static text, audio, and video, and shouldn't need a Rube Goldberg virtual machine to consume. I've been advocating splitting the web into the "document web" (ie the web as it was originally conceived) and the "app web" (which is cool and useful but a different thing) for a while now. There should be two different programs for consuming them.

And to your point, if simple web browsers became useful again, maybe simple operating systems would be viable once more, further reducing the dependencies involved.

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#114

Something I've been thinking about lately is how browsers have essentially become a dependency for any sort of auth on the internet. Pretty much everything uses OAuth2, which requires you to be able to render HTML and CSS, and in many implementations JavaScript. That's ~20M (Firefox) to ~30M (Chromium) lines of code as a dependency for your application, just for auth. This applies even if you have a slick CLI app lik…

SSL cert auth is recognized by every major HTTP server and used by every major browser. Frankly I don’t understand how this still is or ever was an issue.

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#115

Reading the linked site and some of the discussion, I highly recommend finding your nearest Chinese friend or person and getting authorized on Wechat. Its a whole parallel other internet! Kinda similar to how a private set of Facebook pages are otherwise inaccessible with an account, except in a parellel reality where people use them for all business and have no other internet presence. Yes, as a user another governm…

As a wechat user(I made my account during a study abroad in China) I think one of the most interesting feature is the mini programs. They're basically javascript applets within wechat with their own API that do whatever an html5 website can do, but specifically integrated with the platform making account registration and payments more frictionless than even "login with facebook"/Apple Pay. For example you may have he…

Yeah its really impressive! Many western services try to replicate it but the breadth and depth is unmatched

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#116

Something I've been thinking about lately is how browsers have essentially become a dependency for any sort of auth on the internet. Pretty much everything uses OAuth2, which requires you to be able to render HTML and CSS, and in many implementations JavaScript. That's ~20M (Firefox) to ~30M (Chromium) lines of code as a dependency for your application, just for auth. This applies even if you have a slick CLI app lik…

Think of it this way: web browsers are ALLOWING oauth in the first place. Oauth only works when, when a user has to login, they do so in the oauth provider independently - so you need some sort of common dependency that works across all platforms, can execute code (JavaScript). Web browser are pretty much the only cooj denominator - unless you want each device (OS) manufacturer to have to provide their own auth which as a user is a worse solution.

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#117
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Pretty much everything uses OAuth2, which requires you to be able to render HTML and CSS, and in many implementations JavaScript. I don't think this is true. My first (and last, yuck) foray into golang was forking and improving on a REST API client for Questrade[0]. I used it to write a bot that would alert me via push notifications on my phone when certain options contracts met favorable criteria, and despite the a…

If I'm reading that correctly, it looks like you can download your first refresh token manually and then use that to get more tokens. I agree this is technically OAuth2. A more accurate way to articulate my point would be to say "for the services most people want to use, OAuth2 requires a browser".

>for the services most people want to use, OAuth2 requires a browser

Granted, but isn't it also true that the services most people want to use in general require a browser?

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#118
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I'm reading that correctly, it looks like you can download your first refresh token manually and then use that to get more tokens. I agree this is technically OAuth2. A more accurate way to articulate my point would be to say "for the services most people want to use, OAuth2 requires a browser".

>for the services most people want to use, OAuth2 requires a browser Granted, but isn't it also true that the services most people want to use in general require a browser?

Totally, which is probably how we got here. But native apps have gotten very popular, and on every platform I'm aware of they have to launch out to a full browser view in order to authorize against anything.

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#119
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you know someone uses Gemini? They'll tell you the moment they can! Like the vegans of the web...

I didn't want to register for a gemini group just to ask this, but I looked at it from a webdev point of view just long enough to notice there was no evidence of any way to implement a "save comment" or "type in search" feature, basically as if gemini was entirely reduced to mostly static websites with no forms of any kind possible. Is that an accurate assessment?

> I didn't want to register for a gemini group just to ask this

You actually don't need to. Gemini is a client-server architecture just like the web. You can grab a Gemini client, or use some of the web portals out there that make a server-side Gemini request and render the result to the browser.

> or "type in search" feature

There is a limited form of input allowed, but this input shows up as a query parameter essentially. This is how you can do search or offer some form of interactivity and how the current Gemini search engines/crawlers work.

> basically as if gemini was entirely reduced to mostly static websites with no forms of any kind possible

Again Gemini does allow limited forms, but it only accepts a single query parameter as input. You can, of course, parse the parameter however you choose, but the general culture is that there's very little interactivity and most everything is a static page.

Re: Woob: Web Outside of Browsers

#120

Something I've been thinking about lately is how browsers have essentially become a dependency for any sort of auth on the internet. Pretty much everything uses OAuth2, which requires you to be able to render HTML and CSS, and in many implementations JavaScript. That's ~20M (Firefox) to ~30M (Chromium) lines of code as a dependency for your application, just for auth. This applies even if you have a slick CLI app lik…

There are alternatives to OAuth2 like client side TLS, but unfortunately they have terrible UI and keygen functions are being removed from browsers.
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