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54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level

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Re: 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level

#111

In California, Many schools in Califonia use an unproven/inferior method/curriculum for teaching literacy, based on the work of F&P.[1] [0] https://caaspp-elpac.cde.ca.gov/caaspp/DashViewReport?ps=tru... [1] https://www.apmreports.org/story/2021/11/19/fountas-pinnell-...

Folks - it is not the schools - it is the kids and the situations they are raised in.

The schools are nearly identical everywhere. Even crap schools, if you put those teachers in an upper middle class setting, they would shine.

And the most talented teachers in the nation, put into one of those violent inner city schools - would not magically make the the kids pass math.

The kids grow up with single/no parents or one/both parents in jail, no stable job or income, total lack of support at home - or worse, parents that actively call them 'stupid' or tell them they're worthless, zero educated role models, by age 8 idolizing street tough guys, by age 11 wanting to join them, by grade 10 hardly ever showing up, 5 years behind, could care less, getting into fights, peers mocking them if they do well, haven't been out of the neighbourhood in a decade, no serious extra curricular activities etc..

The 2018 OECD/PISA scoring really highlights a lot of these issues.

I was driving through Detroit one night 'for fun' with my work mates to give them a taste of 'some parts of America' - it was 12:45am and on the street corner at the gas station was a child, on his bike, just sitting there waiting for something.

Think of much you can surmise from just that one little thing: a 7 year old, up at 1 am, out in the neighbourhood, hanging out on a Tuesday night. There is no way that story is good, and there are probably 100 things that are bad. Just from that one glimpse you can probably estimate that kid might not be likely to finish school.

Most schools and teachers are good, esp. the one's that have the tenacity to teach in the inner city.

We need decent jobs, stable families, boring nonviolent neighbourhoods, kids who can be free to be 'into' school stuff and the chess club, basic healthcare - i.e. your normal, middle-class semi-aspirational upbringing. If we can do that, grades will go way up to the normal middle class level.

Re: 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level

#113
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What's the gap between an 8th grade reader and a 6th grade reader? They can both interpret the instructions on the side of an AT4 but the 8th grader will be able to tell you that it did not have any alliterations, foreshadowing, or personification. People always forget that at some point in middle school "getting better at reading" stops being about interpreting the literal meanings of sentences and paragraphs and s…

> but the 8th grader will be able to tell you that it did not have any alliterations, foreshadowing, or personification. I don't know what alliteration and personification means and I miss foreshadowing all the time. TIL I'm a 6th grade reader with a master's degree in a computer field. (Basically I'm reading text off screens for ~14 hours per day, doesn't mean I'm necessarily good at it but it's also not as if I'm l…

Some lines of work might not need a meta understanding of prose or poetry - but it can be useful to build up a charismatic (almost cult-like) following if you want to play to the masses.

Alliteration especially when paired with "The rule of 3" is an easy example of a technique you can use to disseminate a memorable message to most people.

Is it useful when writing code? Probably not, but it can help your company when you do your fundraising or pitch to investors.

Re: 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level

#114
post #48

Most of my professional life involved continually being surprised how little most people actually read.

I remember one time being asked at work if I watched some Netflix show du jour ( I believe it was Tiger King at the time) and I replied with: "I don't watch a lot of TV in general. Yes, I have Netflix but don't watch it very often." Then I went to say that in my spare time I like to listen to music and reading. You'd think I'd have said that I'm into being a serial killer. Just weird puzzled and uncomfortable looks.…

> It then struck me that many people, if not most, cannot comprehend spending their leisure time in any way other than passively watching movies, TV or videos on their smartphone or playing video games.

And then you go on to describe your own leisure time as two other passive forms of entertainment. There’s really nothing magic about the written word that makes a medium more challenging, because by historical standards people are literally reading more words than ever. And probably listening to more music than ever too. There’s just as much to dissect and analyze in artsy movies and TV as books and music.

Normally when you want to be snobby about leisure time you’re supposed to talk about creating over consuming.

Re: 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level

#116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, I honestly thought the people here would be better than this

The irony is that HN posters are vehemently against social media, particularly FB. The reasons I’ve read are all about the general negativity, pessimism, false information, etc. While HN submissions are generally held to a higher standard, the general comments/discussions are equally toxic. Apparently FB is such a cancer and everyone else is such a problem - but we’re actually part of the problem.

Skepticism is a far cry from general negativity and pessimism. The relative scarcity of ad hominem attacks on HN is one of the most notable differences to other popular message boards. Personally, I appreciate the open attack on ideas and source credibility, and don't find it toxic at all.

Re: 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level

#117

I couldn't write a coherent sentence until I was 24 years old. A couple years after high school I discovered reading starting with "Cannery Row" however it still took significant effort to learn to write despite thousands of hours of reading. Once I understood the basic mechanics of grammar, fitting words into meaningful structures became second nature. I still can't spell the word coherent without assistance from a…

> People are hostile when I say there isn't such a thing as a learning disability but rather only teaching disabilities.

Well, because it is wrong. Nonetheless, those are not mutually exclusive. The fact that there are bad teachers that do not know how to teach, does not mean that there are no people that legitimately do have learning disabilities.

Re: 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level

#118

I couldn't write a coherent sentence until I was 24 years old. A couple years after high school I discovered reading starting with "Cannery Row" however it still took significant effort to learn to write despite thousands of hours of reading. Once I understood the basic mechanics of grammar, fitting words into meaningful structures became second nature. I still can't spell the word coherent without assistance from a…

I used to have a math teacher who would mock me for not doing particularly great. It was very obvious that he derived great pleasure from putting down kids not knowing the material in advance. I had to deal with this psycho from grades 5 to 8.

It still blows my mind that a person whose job was to teach did his best to praise those who came already prepared and vigorously kick everyone else.

Re: 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level

#120

I couldn't write a coherent sentence until I was 24 years old. A couple years after high school I discovered reading starting with "Cannery Row" however it still took significant effort to learn to write despite thousands of hours of reading. Once I understood the basic mechanics of grammar, fitting words into meaningful structures became second nature. I still can't spell the word coherent without assistance from a…

> Cannery Row

Good choice of reading there.

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