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This is a mean spirited comment that doesn't belong on HN. Not going to argue but I don't feel that comments like these add anything of value to the discussion.
People on this forum NEED to look at what they contribute to the world, i imagine some of them wont want to.
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The Bay Area is 6900 square miles of land and cost of living is as high as any other metro on average per square mile. London, Tokyo, New York and pretty much every other major metropolis has problems akin to the Bay Area but we never quite as frequently refer to London or Tokyo “falling apart” the way we like to attract all our collective attention to bash the Bay Area here.
> London, Tokyo, New York and pretty much every other major metropolis has problems akin to the Bay Area I've never lived in the Bay Area/SF so I can't comment on the problems there, but I have lived in London for the past few years. I volunteer extensively with the homeless, and I haven't seen a fraction of what people describe in San Francisco, or anywhere near the level of antisocial behaviour or crime. Every week…
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They don't need to convince you that there's a chance for 4x growth, they need to convince those specific individuals that there's a chance. And those engineers are immersed in a culture that could affect their perception of Apple's potential.
Apple is targeting its next 10 years' growth in three key markets: Laptops, VR/AR, and EVs. How big is each market cap?
EV has huge potential, but has a lot of competition, and Apple would be late to the party and without any serious advantages, technological, ecosystem, or otherwise. On the contrary, they'd have to build delivery and repair networks from scratch ( assuming they delegate all manufacturing). Even for their endless financial reserves, it seems very improbable they'd get anywhere serious within 10 years in the EV market.
Laptops - that's a tough market with lots of competition and long retention ( as in people rarely upgrade, and tend to stick to manufacturers), many of it Apple simply cannot and could not overcome ( Windows will probably remain the de facto enterprise standard for some more time). They finally have a serious technological advantage beyond more abstract, subjective or niche ones ( better UX or light or long batter life) advantages.
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Designers and PMs. Apple is being ran by designers and PMs. Which is not really a bad thing from users point of view.
Apple has product managers?
I don’t think I have never come across an actual product manager at apple. Design tends to make on most of that responsibility
Apple is reaching a size where the un-coordination of its leadership and processes as it has grown (while yet rigorously enforcing other negative aspects of corporate culture) are producing a place that is harder and harder to enjoy working for. It worked for a while when the company was small enough and lines of command were short enough for leadership to control effectively, but it has grown while the people proces…
+1. I used to think there were some generalizations that could be made based on company size, etc, but now I have realized that it is pretty similar everywhere (except possibly a < 50 employee startup).
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> now the area around it is falling apart Lol. As a current Cupertino resident and non-Apple employee, this is the nicest place I’ve ever lived. Massive perfect roads, extremely low crime or homelessness, modern buildings, and easy access to freeways. It’s not at all like downtown SF
If two of your four points concern roads, especially how "massive" they are, then I think many people would disagree with your definition of nice.
Apple is reaching a size where the un-coordination of its leadership and processes as it has grown (while yet rigorously enforcing other negative aspects of corporate culture) are producing a place that is harder and harder to enjoy working for. It worked for a while when the company was small enough and lines of command were short enough for leadership to control effectively, but it has grown while the people proces…
Serious question: what are the companies where this is not true? My experience personally and from what I have heard from others, this is basically true at every tech workplace today
https://techcrunch.com/2010/11/11/google-offers-staff-engine...
That was Facebook-Google though. Apple likes to do no-poaches... https://www.cnet.com/news/apple-google-others-settle-anti-po...
Pretty much everyone I know who worked in Software at Apple had a bad experience. The common refrain was that engineers are treated like crap at apple, and it's the designers who get all the glory. It makes me excited for the future of software engineering to see moves like this. Clearly Apple, and many other companies, are starting to understand just how critical devs are to a modern business. And they are finding t…
FWIW, the Apple software devs I know really enjoy their jobs. They all agree that it's not easy work, but I don't know anyone there who claims mistreatment. Small sample size, of course. > It makes me excited for the future of software engineering to see moves like this. Clearly Apple, and many other companies, are starting to understand just how critical devs are to a modern business. As a counterpoint, some of the…