Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired • Hacker News Board

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#111

Post by xnyan » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:15 PM UTC

nsxwolf wrote: post #15

xnyan wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>We were promised this wouldn't happen by our governments last year right? We were promised that a company can't require a vaccine as a condition of employment? Seeing as some companies have required vaccines for as long as there have been vaccines, I think I must be misunderstanding you. >Why are private companies stuck policing these absurd policies? Companies are requiring the vaccine because they make employees l…

With the exception of healthcare I don't think a lot of companies have mandated vaccines. My wife works in healthcare and there was a tuberculosis shot mandate for specific jobs at her hospital. There was a flu shot mandate of sorts, but it was tied to a small bonus. You can't point to a small sector that has mandates and say it wouldn't be a significant change if suddenly 100% of all workers everywhere were subjecte…

Millions of people in various sectors outside healthcare (by the way, since when is healthcare a "small sector"?) have had vaccines required as a condition of employment. , mostly people with plenty of risk like teachers, the military and some people working in the travel industry, but this is not always the case. I was required to get the flu shot (or an exemption) in my last job at an electrical engineering firm.

On a broader note, I think (coming from the US) workers should have stronger protections against being fired, but everyone I've personally talked to who does not believe your employer should be able to fire you for not getting a vaccine is also opposed to "state controlled employment" or almost anything else that exerts control over the employer-employee relationship. You can be fired for almost any reason in the US, being fired for not getting a vaccine does not seem any worse to me than being fired for any number of awful yet totally legal reasons.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#112

Post by k8si » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:15 PM UTC

orang2tang wrote: post #95

acdha wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is just life, forever. Totally unprecedented. You will get a vaccination every 6 months for the rest of your life or be totally excluded from all civil rights. “all civil rights” meaning you have full civil rights but can't force a private company to give you a job when you refuse to follow safety rules? Especially in a country where employers pay for healthcare it doesn't seem unreasonable to require a safe,…

You're forgetting that a majority of the companies implementing these policies are doing so at the behest of the federal government. You think Google doesn't do business with the US government, who does business with drug manufacturers? Private company? on PAPER, sure... Government mandating private business to inject their workers every 6 months to save face (and $$$) for the "vaccine" manufacturers is fascist and a…

Most of my co-workers who have kids will not go back to our office unless our company enforces a vaccine mandate. So anecdotally, I can say that at least some workers at some companies are also putting pressure on to implement vaccine mandates.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#113

Post by bravetraveler » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:16 PM UTC

comrh wrote: post #74

nsxwolf wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With the exception of healthcare I don't think a lot of companies have mandated vaccines. My wife works in healthcare and there was a tuberculosis shot mandate for specific jobs at her hospital. There was a flu shot mandate of sorts, but it was tied to a small bonus. You can't point to a small sector that has mandates and say it wouldn't be a significant change if suddenly 100% of all workers everywhere were subjecte…

Any business doing work with the US government will have to mandate vaccines.

My employer already went this route, something about a fed mandate for their contractors... and we have a lot of those. They extended it to everyone lol

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#114

Post by bellyfullofbac » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:16 PM UTC

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #44

criddell wrote: post #38

At some point I wonder if health insurers will start denying claims related to the treatment of COVID infections if the person is eligible for the vaccine but has refused to get one? On TV today I saw that Kroger employees don't get sick day pay if they are off because of COVID unless they have been vaccinated (and I would assume there's a medical exemption).

Accusations of Racism. Only 28% of young black people in New York are vaccinated as of October, for example. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/12/nyregion/covid-vaccine-bl... Edit: Added "young" adjective that was missing, point remains.

Ah yeah, anti-vaxxers (I'm not calling you one) grasping at straws including calling the vax mandates racist because of the low vax uptake from Black people.

If it was a policy that's based on something that the Black people can't change about them (e.g. refusal to entry to a club based on your address, with majority black areas of town being in that list), and it disadvantages them, yes that'd be racist. But in this case, the Black people (or whoever) can easily change it by getting vaxed...

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#115

Post by titzer » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:17 PM UTC

lb0 wrote: post #52

jaquer_1 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. Force people into draconian measures that won't stop infection and violate their rights. 2. Convince them that it's necessary to stop the pandemic without giving any arguments. 3. Have them defend your measures in public forums and feel very smart.

> draconian measures really? What's the fuzz about anti vaxxers always talking about "won't stop infection" or "stop the pandemic" - 1st this is not black and white - 2nd and nowhere I have seen that these are the actual arguments for these measures?

> "won't stop infection" or "stop the pandemic" - 1st this is not black and white

Seriously. Mitigating the damage from failure to contain and eradicate the virus when we had the chance (in the precious few early weeks where lockdowns had that potential, but guess what, the same people f'd that up) involves filter after filter after filter. Each filter reduces spread and severity by some amount. Masks reduce (but don't eliminate) transmission. Vaccines reduce (but don't eliminate) infections. Vaccines reduce the length of infection, reducing transmission. Lockdowns and social distancing reduce the spread. On and on. Every single measure is applying a filter that might only be 90% successful. That is no way a logical argument for no filter at all.

These people really don't understand how bad this pandemic would be if we had no mitigation measures at all. The entire hospital system would collapse and millions (more--probably tens of millions) would die. Yet that's what they constantly argue for. Yet forcing people to get a needle in their arm is "draconian".

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#116

Post by input_sh » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:18 PM UTC

wedowhatwedo wrote: post #36

cfcf14 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For many people, it's more than just a jab, it's 1-3 days of being quite unwell. I have no underlying health conditions, but I've been bedridden by my 2nd shot and booster shots, with a high fever, fatigue, dizziness, and aches for at least 48 hours. My partner who is immuno-compromised is worse off, generally being very ill for 1-2 weeks after each jab. Her case is somewhat different though, as her situation is just…

This is why the company I work for will give you up to three paid days off after getting a vaccine shot. Feeling bad after the shot should not be a reason to not get it.

Hell, mine even reimbursed traveling to another country before they were available to the general public in my own country.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#117

Post by ethbr0 » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:18 PM UTC

dbnap wrote: post #103

Employees who do not wish to receive the vaccine sacrament should quit, move to Florida and found a new search engine. They are probably the better ones anyway, since they have some hacker spirit left.

How is putting a crash-developed mRNA vaccine that synthesizes custom-designed antigens into your body, in order to help the greater good, not hacker spirit?

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#118

Post by Karsteski » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:19 PM UTC

bellyfullofbac wrote: post #114

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Accusations of Racism. Only 28% of young black people in New York are vaccinated as of October, for example. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/12/nyregion/covid-vaccine-bl... Edit: Added "young" adjective that was missing, point remains.

Ah yeah, anti-vaxxers (I'm not calling you one) grasping at straws including calling the vax mandates racist because of the low vax uptake from Black people. If it was a policy that's based on something that the Black people can't change about them (e.g. refusal to entry to a club based on your address, with majority black areas of town being in that list), and it disadvantages them, yes that'd be racist. But in this…

It's important to keep in mind that black people have very many reasons to distrust government.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#119

Post by Radim » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:20 PM UTC

solididiot wrote: post #56

criddell wrote: post #38

At some point I wonder if health insurers will start denying claims related to the treatment of COVID infections if the person is eligible for the vaccine but has refused to get one? On TV today I saw that Kroger employees don't get sick day pay if they are off because of COVID unless they have been vaccinated (and I would assume there's a medical exemption).

In my country (EU) COVID incidents get handled by public health system only. Which was not in great shape to begin with. Health insurers had bailed out since day zero on COVID. There's lately though talk about unvaccinated COVID patients bearing the cost nonetheless. Note that public health system is for free.

> Note that public health system is for free.

In my country (also EU) the public health system is most definitely not "free". It is paid for by a universal tax called (insidiously and inaccurately) "health insurance".

> There's lately though talk about unvaccinated COVID patients bearing the cost nonetheless.

Calls for true insurance (individualized, based on actual health and habits) are completely infeasible for political reasons.

What I can see happening is the existing mandatory health tax PLUS extra payments for non-grata groups. Some constitutional changes may be needed, but since all the right people would profit (extra $$$), that's just a technical detail in this day and age.

Re: Google says employees flouting vaccination rules will eventually be fired

#120

Post by astura » Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 3:20 PM UTC

srean wrote: post #75

nsxwolf wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we eventually define "civil rights" to mean "you have the right to stay inside your home and order everything on Amazon", we have a serious problem. That's where this is going. It goes way beyond the decisions of an individual company. Regarding the status quo: Yes, mandates exist. The school example is a piece of paper you turn into the school office during enrollment and no one ever thinks about it again. It's n…

Have you been this upset all this while at the fact that international students have been required to take a bunch of different vaccines as a prerequisite for admission in US colleges ? You may have been, I don't know.

In fact, in my state all students, international or not, are required tot take a bunch of different vaccines before they are allowed to attend classes.

My friend started college in his late 30s and didn't have access to his childhood immunizations since it was so long ago. He had to get a blood test showing immunity before he could attend class.