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Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

cbc.ca

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Re: Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

#111

Post by berdario »

duxup wrote: post #102
throw373782 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is "laughing at the absurdity of it" supposed to convince people of something? Look, no one can convince someone of something when they are hellbent on seeing things in a certain light. I’m sure if you look hard enough, you can find some Uyghur somewhere in those videos blinking out “HELP ME” in morse. But if Westerners are hyperventilating over Uyghur genocide while thousands of actual Uyghurs living in Xinjiang a…

>But if Westerners are hyperventilating over Uyghur genocide while thousands of actual Uyghurs living in Xinjiang are making videos laughing at the allegations, don’t you think there’s something wrong with that picture? This is what I don't get. Such reliance on one off social media examples. If I found a video that said otherwise ... would that convince you? Why would you think it works the other way? Such reliance…

It's not only one-off social media samples...

When an actual genocide happens, you see massive flows of refugees trying to escape. Where are the news of massive flows of Chinese refugees in Kazakhstan, Russia, Kyrgyzstan?

Re: Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

#112

Post by dleslie »

abledon wrote: post #109
ygjb wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty straightforward; from 2012-2015 the previous government, led by Stephen Harper (Prime Minister), and in partnership with Erin O'Toole (at the time Parliamentary Secretary with oversight over International Trade) negotiated a trade agreement with China [1]. Under this treaty, if the Canadian government takes actions that damage or undermine Chinese investment in Canada, then Chinese companies can sue Canad…

Wow, that is nasty, and the article makes no mention of this? Is there a page on the canadian government website that details this agreement with china?

https://www.international.gc.ca/trade-commerce/trade-agreeme...

Re: Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

#113

Post by dominotw »

TheCapn wrote: post #79
dominotw wrote: post #26

what happens next? Wouldn't this now imply canadians are now open to doing business with genocidal govt?

We continue to sell military equipment to Saudi Arabia despite objections to their actions in Yemen. A lot of what our gov't does is very ceremonial with no teeth

> We continue to sell military equipment to Saudi Arabia despite objections to their actions in Yemen.

But we never declared it a genocide. Isn't a big difference, otherwise why would this even be news worthy.

Re: Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

#114

Post by dleslie »

1MachineElf wrote: post #97
ygjb wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty straightforward; from 2012-2015 the previous government, led by Stephen Harper (Prime Minister), and in partnership with Erin O'Toole (at the time Parliamentary Secretary with oversight over International Trade) negotiated a trade agreement with China [1]. Under this treaty, if the Canadian government takes actions that damage or undermine Chinese investment in Canada, then Chinese companies can sue Canad…

Sounds like somewhat the TPP. I wonder what in the trade agreement made this a worthwhile compromise.

It basically ensured that Canada could do little to stymie resource exploitation projects that receive Chinese investment funds; this is a boon to Albertan/Saskatchewan oil companies, and BC coal companies.

Re: Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

#115

Post by pletsch »

908B64B197 wrote: post #39
nickff wrote: post #4

Interesting that the parliament went ahead with a vote, from which the 'leadership' (cabinet) abstained; I wonder what's going on behind the scenes. >"Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and almost all of his cabinet colleagues were absent for the vote. Foreign Affairs Minister Marc Garneau was the only cabinet minister present. When it was his turn, he said he abstained "on behalf of the Government of Canada." "

Not surprising. The Trudeau family has always supported dictatorships, such as the Castro regime in Cuba. The son even went as far as calling Fidel "larger than life leader who served his people" [0] [0] https://www.cnn.com/2016/11/27/world/justin-trudeau-castro-e...

Not going on either side here but for what it's worth, Cuba is viewed differently in Canada vs the US

Re: Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

#117

Post by jcranmer »

ygjb wrote: post #62
nickff wrote: post #4

Interesting that the parliament went ahead with a vote, from which the 'leadership' (cabinet) abstained; I wonder what's going on behind the scenes. >"Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and almost all of his cabinet colleagues were absent for the vote. Foreign Affairs Minister Marc Garneau was the only cabinet minister present. When it was his turn, he said he abstained "on behalf of the Government of Canada." "

It's pretty straightforward; from 2012-2015 the previous government, led by Stephen Harper (Prime Minister), and in partnership with Erin O'Toole (at the time Parliamentary Secretary with oversight over International Trade) negotiated a trade agreement with China [1]. Under this treaty, if the Canadian government takes actions that damage or undermine Chinese investment in Canada, then Chinese companies can sue Canad…

Quickly reading the treaty itself (you can too at https://www.international.gc.ca/trade-commerce/trade-agreeme...), I see this bit in 33(5)(c):

> Nothing in this Agreement shall be construed [...] to prevent a Contracting Party from taking action in pursuance of its obligations under the United Nations Charter for the maintenance of international peace and security.

Labeling an act as genocide and taking measures against China as a result of it would fall under that clause, so any Chinese investors who would sue would be out of luck.

Re: Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

#119

Post by dleslie »

jcranmer wrote: post #117
ygjb wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty straightforward; from 2012-2015 the previous government, led by Stephen Harper (Prime Minister), and in partnership with Erin O'Toole (at the time Parliamentary Secretary with oversight over International Trade) negotiated a trade agreement with China [1]. Under this treaty, if the Canadian government takes actions that damage or undermine Chinese investment in Canada, then Chinese companies can sue Canad…

Quickly reading the treaty itself (you can too at https://www.international.gc.ca/trade-commerce/trade-agreeme... ), I see this bit in 33(5)(c): > Nothing in this Agreement shall be construed [...] to prevent a Contracting Party from taking action in pursuance of its obligations under the United Nations Charter for the maintenance of international peace and security. Labeling an act as genocide and taking measures ag…

The tribunals are outside of the scope of the normal Canadian justice system and can act entirely in secret; there's no guarantee, really, that they can be counted on to agree that such a declaration is within the scope of that clause. We Canadians might not ever know how they ruled, if they ruled at all, and how much it cost us in total.

Re: Canada's parliament votes to label China's persecution of Uighurs as genocide

#120

Post by duxup »

throw373782 wrote: post #110
duxup wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But if Westerners are hyperventilating over Uyghur genocide while thousands of actual Uyghurs living in Xinjiang are making videos laughing at the allegations, don’t you think there’s something wrong with that picture? This is what I don't get. Such reliance on one off social media examples. If I found a video that said otherwise ... would that convince you? Why would you think it works the other way? Such reliance…

It’s no different than how the entire Western media establishment has been relying on one-off style testimonies pushing atrocity propaganda and basing almost their entire genocide thesis off of anecdotal evidence. You’re acting like it’s my goal or duty to convince you, which is not the case. You can choose to believe what you want to believe. My simple goal here today is to make the point that the US has a long trac…

I don't think you're required to provide me anything at all.

>It’s no different than how the entire Western media establishment has been relying on one-off style testimonies pushing atrocity propaganda and basing almost their entire genocide thesis off of anecdotal evidence.

I think you greatly misunderstand how western media operates.

But that's not really surprising. I find folks who sympathize with non free states often misunderstand that their government's propaganda is not equal to how western media operates. It's just not a 1:1.

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