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Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

protocol.com

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Re: Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

#111

Post by ramraj07 »

jw1224 wrote: post #60

Honestly, Apple's response is actually pretty reasonable, all things considered. Read the full letter — it was clear, fair, and professional — despite coming off the back of a lot of bad press. I see plenty of comments are focussing on this quote, re their Basecamp apps: > These apps do not offer in-app purchase — and, consequently, have not contributed any revenue to the App Store over the last eight years Apple hav…

Disagree. They let Dropbox slide, and it looks arbitrary that HEY is considered that different. If HEY stores your email in their servers they should argue that they are also similar to Dropbox then and should be exempted. This seems like Apple drew an arbitrary line where it still can draw one, and is having a tantrum. Nevertheless the arrogance of suggesting that their benevolence is why apps like basecamp have survived is just boggling. They make the best devices for sure but I keep hoping other companies start stepping up and give them real competition.

Re: Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

#112

Post by richardwhiuk »

myguysi wrote: post #56
richardwhiuk wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Distribution. Access to iOS devices.

Access to a market that they solely own, the definition of antitrust.

If it didn't provide any value, Hey wouldn't be so concerned with losing it.

Re: Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

#115

Post by IncRnd »

fierarul wrote: post #13

Maybe the pandemic finally offers enough motivation for EU and US to make a strong decision about this. The (smart)phone market, for many people the only computing device they own, is utterly dominated by 2 monopolies under Apple and Google. The CEOs should get a medal and all the honours for providing society this good platforms then promptly forced to allow separate AppStores on equal footing.

> is utterly dominated by 2 monopolies under Apple and Google.

duopoly not monopoly

Re: Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

#116

Post by hyko »

take_a_breath wrote: post #64
hyko wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These aren’t Apple’s rules–they’re ours. It’s the parameters of a free marketplace and flows from the idea of legal ownership of property. Apple has a minority share of the smartphone market, so antitrust does not apply. Antitrust a specific remedy to prevent monopolistic abuses. If I build a high end hotel and the fee is $10,000 a night to stay there, you can’t apply to the Supreme Court to have your bill reduced. I…

This analogy makes no sense. It’s not a business to consumer issue. The problem is Apple running their own marketplace and inconsistently applying the rules they have created for that marketplace. If the hotel opened a food court and treated the vendors like this, it might be an apt analogy.

Well, let’s use the food court analogy then: whoever owns the food court is permitted by law to set whatever rental prices they choose for their tenants (provided they aren’t discriminating against people based on certain characteristics). They don’t have to be consistent, because the food court is their property and they have very wide discretion over how it is used. Fair? No. Legal? Yes!

Re: Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

#117

Post by MoroCode »

gecko wrote: post #53
rvz wrote: post #17

Maybe they should follow what Netflix is doing, since they don't have in-app purchases in iOS which is why they don't allow registrations at all and force you to sign up on the web. Not sure about Netflix's Android app though, but Google has sort of done this to Epic Games but only allowing logins and no registrations + card checks might bypass the Apple 30% tax.

They did—or at least, are trying to. The issue is Apple is saying, based on unwritten rules, that Netflix is allowed to do it, while Hey isn’t. And that’s the crux of the problem

The reason Netflix is allowed to do it is because they are classified as a reader app

> if an app is a way to exclusively consume content purchased elsewhere, like songs or movies or podcasts, they don't have to have in-app purchases.

According to apple an exclusive email client is not classified as a reader app and so they are forced to offer in app purchases. The guidelines are super confusing and in my opinion pretty crap but it's not a case of favouritism or giving special exemptions to Netflix for example

Re: Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

#118

Post by rydre »

philistine wrote: post #63
rvz wrote: post #17

Maybe they should follow what Netflix is doing, since they don't have in-app purchases in iOS which is why they don't allow registrations at all and force you to sign up on the web. Not sure about Netflix's Android app though, but Google has sort of done this to Epic Games but only allowing logins and no registrations + card checks might bypass the Apple 30% tax.

Be honest. Have you read articles about the subject thoroughly? Hey is implemented exactly like Netflix. This is exactly why it’s making such a ruckus. Because big streaming giants get Better treatment than the little guy trying to reinvent email.

This. Many of the commentators on this issue are really lazy people. Please before making suggestions, get background information.

Re: Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

#119

Post by Keats »

jw1224 wrote: post #60

Honestly, Apple's response is actually pretty reasonable, all things considered. Read the full letter — it was clear, fair, and professional — despite coming off the back of a lot of bad press. I see plenty of comments are focussing on this quote, re their Basecamp apps: > These apps do not offer in-app purchase — and, consequently, have not contributed any revenue to the App Store over the last eight years Apple hav…

> Apple have (freely) provided Basecamp a platform to grow their business via the App Store, whilst giving Apple (effectively) nothing in return.

So the apps on the App Store don't provide any value to Apple? If all business apps were only on Android, would they have the same market share?

Re: Apple sends a letter to Hey: Change your app or get out of the App Store

#120

Post by imron »

> The HEY Email app is marketed as an email app on the App Store, but when users download your app, it does not work. Users cannot use the app to access email or perform any useful function until after they go to the Basecamp website for Hey Email and purchase a license to use the HEY Email app.

The Fastmail email app works exactly the same way and is available on the app store without issue. Seems like a pretty arbitrary decision here.

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