> Zoom did not respond to a request for comment. When you can't say anything that won't get you into deeper trouble, say nothing at all.
Problems usually go away if you ignore them for long enough.
Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
111–120 of 562 posts
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#112I feel like the good faith presumption for this company has to have shifted by now. Is there any reason not to assume that the Chinese government is surveilling Zoom calls en masse? Documenting participants (face, voice, language, location, etc.), recording content, etc. We're talking about the data of 200M+ users. I see people on HN defending Zoom all the time. >The company has acknowledged that much of its product…
Doesn't the Chinese government have transparency in their surveillance?
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#113Guys, guys, it's fine. According to everybody on HN who's so eagerly embraced Zoom and continued to use it even after the security issues, the only thing that matters is that Zoom is the best UX experience for video conferencing. Forget about the human rights, suppression of free speech or the fact that the company is wholly subservient to the CCP (not like anybody could've ever foreseen anything like this ever happe…
No. Zoom should be banned and its CEO ousted.
The company should be purged from all Chinese influences.
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#114I am confused.. are we supposed to be surprised by this?
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#115Earlier quoted context omitted.
> it wouldn't be very conducive to their government's interests. It depends on your timeline. If you eliminate dissent you may be able to push through short-term aims or develop a facsimile of national unity, but you will naturally eliminate nuance from your geopolitics. Even one or two generations into this experiment, you can wind up with a leader who truly "drinks the koolaid," who assumes the state propaganda to…
Is the regime doomed? The people are screwed, sure, but once a government turns into a self-serving dictatorship, it can stay that way for a long time. Usually the first thing dictators do is disarm civilians and beef up the military, so the only way out is via a military coup (which usually just trades one regime for an equivalent one). In just 2 decades, North Korea will have had a dictatorship for a century.
The Roman Empire, a thousand years?
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#116Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not all governments are equal. Cut out this whaddaboutism. Edit: When I replied, OP was simply “governments monitor all major companies... including the US government”
Whataboutism is usually done to defend something by making it look better in comparison but what the OP was arguing is that we should be pursuing end to end encrypted solutions exclusively because it’s not just the Chinese government who are doing the snooping. ie he’s not defending Zoom nor the Chinese government but suggesting the complaint against Zoom/China doesn’t go far enough
Exactly. Assume that governments and large companies can and will spy on you and act accordingly. Do not get suckered into some simplistic nationalistic narrative in which "our" side is good.
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#117Earlier quoted context omitted.
Zoom is a company I have loved so far, but a lot of this is starting to really rub me the wrong way and I really don't want to have to go find another solution. However, without some sort of reversal, this is enough for me to deal with the mess of doing that.
> Zoom is a company I have loved so far Do you love the company, its leadership, its product, or its pricing?
>Do you love the company, its leadership, its product, or its pricing?
you didn't ask me, but imo they haven't existed long enough to garnish love for their company and leadership.
They had a product and a price point at a time with huge & abnormal sudden demand. I think this alone was enough to make them successful in the short term.
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#118Guys, guys, it's fine. According to everybody on HN who's so eagerly embraced Zoom and continued to use it even after the security issues, the only thing that matters is that Zoom is the best UX experience for video conferencing. Forget about the human rights, suppression of free speech or the fact that the company is wholly subservient to the CCP (not like anybody could've ever foreseen anything like this ever happe…
I mostly agree with what you are trying to say, but being snarky is against the hn guidelines. Edit: “against” is too strong a word - it isn’t a hard rule but I often see the hn community react negatively to sarcasm and snarkiness even though the content may be worthwhile.
After seeing plenty of discussions on HN where people expressed how they'd rather keep using Zoom despite 1) clear security issues and 2) the development teams living in China, I didn't feel there was any other way to express the issue (and the discrepancy in values). There seems to be a blindness to geopolitical realities in the tech world, and this occurrence is the perfect example.
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#119Earlier quoted context omitted.
> find another solution Have you tried Jitsi?
I've wanted to like Jitsi, but the quality difference with Zoom is noticeable. Same with Google Meet and anything I've seen that uses WebRTC. They remind me of RealPlayer back in the early 2000s in terms of blockyness. I would love to know about any Zoom competitors, free or paid, with comparable quality.
Wire.com may be of interest to you. I have been checking out a few as well.
Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event
#120I feel like the good faith presumption for this company has to have shifted by now. Is there any reason not to assume that the Chinese government is surveilling Zoom calls en masse? Documenting participants (face, voice, language, location, etc.), recording content, etc. We're talking about the data of 200M+ users. I see people on HN defending Zoom all the time. >The company has acknowledged that much of its product…
Doesn't the Chinese government have transparency in their surveillance?
Is that a joke? We know nothing about what data they collect for what purposes. Just that they do.