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Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

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Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#111
post #32

Really curious to hear the rational from supposedly small government republicans

>The draft order also requires the Attorney General to establish a working group including state attorneys general that will examine the enforcement of state laws that prohibit online platforms from engaging in unfair and deceptive acts.

>The working group will also monitor or create watch-lists of users based on their interactions with content or other users.[1]

I'm sure there are plenty of "small government" and libertarian-leaning folks who are now in favor of government watch lists based off who and what US citizens interact with on social media.

[1] - https://www.reuters.com/article/twitter-trump-executive-orde...

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#112
post #18

> "Currently, social media giants like Twitter received unprecedented viability shield based on the theory that they are a neutral platform, which they are not," Trump said in the Oval Office. "We are fed up with it. It is unfair, and it's been very unfair." What examples of this unfairness are being referred to? I never understand why journalist don't press harder and follow up with obvious questions. Same with "man…

Journalists do followup with obvious questions, but the WHPS doesn't answer them.

Why do they not keep pushing back with "you haven't answered my question" though? If it's so easy to ignore hard question, why doesn't everyone just do this to avoid criticism from the press?

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#113
post #92

What's surprising is how often I encounter fellow Americans mistakenly asserting the first amendment extends beyond government and into the private sector. It's like they've never even been to a movie theater where they need to shut the hell up or leave. And here we have a US president signing an executive order in response to being moderated on a web site after years of arguably excessive tolerance of his b.s. I'm n…

Most people totally miss the point.

The first amendment is there from preventing the government from controlling the speech. Exactly what Trump is doing to Twitter right now.

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#114
post #20

I don't think there is legal basis for Trump's order, but Twitter is wading into murky territory with their actions. Twitter's "fact check" singles out a specific Trump tweet. It's clearly a human intervention by Twitter staff, not user generated content. The subject of Trump's tweet was a political dispute, and while Trump certainly had false statements in his tweet, that's basically par for the course on Twitter. T…

This is a pretty rational argument. Where does one draw the line with "fact checks". I don't like Trump at all. Which is why I don't like seeing "My political tribe disagrees with you" down votes. Shouldn't we be better than that? In general the HN crowd tends to be for free speech and less with platforms censoring or restricting people. Now yes Trump says downright false things all the time, and IMO is a dangerous person. But let's take him out of the equation and look at this objectively.

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its an interesting thought experiment to assess in what ways Twitter is a "private website". It really is a public web space that is operated by a private company, but I can't help but feel that the nuances and similarities of what Twitter really is and what responsibility they truly hold in society is above the courts comprehension.

Do you have the right to stand in your community's biggest mall screaming racist things or does the property owner/operator have the right to remove you from the premise?

The Pruneyard decision [1] though did conclude that the sidewalks (even privately owned walkways) outside a business were quasi-public spaces analogous to public squares.

[1] https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/447/74

About your specific question, I would say "standing INSIDE the mall screaming" (screaming anything) would be more similar to posting large amounts of text on someone else's personal Twitter feed.

Whereas simply having your own personal Twitter and saying things that someone doesn't like would be more like standing on the walkway outside a business.

Also, I read the draft of Trump's order posted on HN last night, and it doesn't say that lewd or obscene content can't be removed. If you start using the N word or posting pornography, I think that's still legitimate for companies to remove.

The problem is that the idea of "hate speech" is being weaponized. If someone simply wears a MAGA hat, that's being called "threatening" or "racist". If someone expresses economically protectionist views, they're called "racist" even though protectionism was used centuries ago to protect European countries from other European countries and has nothing to do with "race".

The right could similarly weaponize the idea of "hate speech" by saying that any time anyone mentions any kind of social program spending, that's "threatening" because that's akin to "communism, which has killed hundreds of millions of people".

Now, plenty of conservatives do say they're concerned about the slippery slope, but they don't immediately equate "we should give housing to the homeless" with "put the rich in the gulags", the way the vocal far left equates "maybe we should reduce taxes a bit" with "they're racists who want poor minority people to starve to death".

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#116
post #75
post #32

Really curious to hear the rational from supposedly small government republicans

Supposedly being the key word. Those that get into power tend to only grow the size of government and debt.

Yeah, neither party is concerned about the financial well being of the country. Seems like financiers are running things.

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#117
post #97

Does that mean we can sue Fox entertainment fake news network?

You can already sue them. For example, if Fox runs a segment claiming that you (gulli1010) are a murderer, you can sue them for slander (with or without this executive order). If someone tweets that you are a murderer, you can't sue Twitter (or rather, if you do, Twitter will be protected by Section 230). However, suppose Twitter announces the following policy: "Any tweet which calls someone a murderer, shall be dele…

People should look into the Seth Rich lawsuit and Ed Butowsky. Trump forgets his crowd is the one who constantly panders conspiracy theories like PizzaGate and QAnon. This will effectively take them down entirely.

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#118
The big problem that needs to be addressed is network effects. When the feature that matters most to users is the presence of other users, the result is a platform that can do all kinds of harm.

The power and money in Big Tech result from platforms where network effects leave users, businesses, competitors, even other countries unable to switch to or create viable alternatives. In theory they can, but in practice, they have to be where everyone else is.

If Twitter, for example, were an open protocol that you accessed through your ISP like email to join the world conversation, their own opinions wouldn't matter more than anyone else's. If instead there is a single company that decides who gets to say what on their platform, and network effects build a castle wall, regulations should force a change (such as opening the protocol) to make alternatives viable.

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#119
post #42
post #32

Really curious to hear the rational from supposedly small government republicans

As much as there ever really were "small government republicans" there certainly aren't any today. "Owning the libs" is the only reason the current batch of conservatives gets out of bed in the morning. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/nratv-dan-bongino-my-life-is-...

> Owning the libs

We should call what it is. They working to make the lives of other US citizens as miserable as they can. Whoever does this is working against their own country. This is unpatriotic.

Re: Trump signs executive order targeting protections for social media companies

#120
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "yep, no conservative viewpoints allowed here." At least it'd be clear if they said so, nothing worse than the current situation where they think it but won't say it because it'd be bad for business.

I mean, I even disagree that there's major 'anti-conservative' bias at all. Some prominent conservatives have been banned from the platform, like Alex Jones, but it wasn't due to their views on Keynesian economics, it was for spreading outright lies about Sandy Hook. Diving deeper into almost any of the examples that people dig up as 'anti-conservative bias' reveals trolling, hateful attacks, or other bad behavior, c…

Exactly, for some reason people will throw out toxic lies, racism, conspiracy theories, etc. and then act like those are just their 'political views'. I hope we aren't at a turning point where conspiracy theories and suppression of journalism is a 'political viewpoint'.
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