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Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

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Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#111

Post by masklinn »

Lost_BiomedE wrote: post #57
squidsoup wrote: post #34

As beautiful as this demo is, I think the push for realism has harmed the game industry more than it has move it forward. One of the few developers in recent memory that has managed to focus on both visual fidelity and gameplay is Bioware with the Mass Effect series; for the most part most developers aren't this successful and end up producing beautiful but lifeless, dull games. Also consider that producing art asset…

I think another great exception is the elder scrolls series by bethesda. Every time I see new physics engine, better AI, or better graphics, I think, 'What can Bethesda do with this?'

I agree with Bonch here: Oblivion is one of the worst examples of this very trend: it was stunningly beautiful (especially if you had a monster machine), but for that it traded animation (crappy, especially the faces), scenario, originality, gameplay (though I'm sure the consoles objectives helped there), …

Apart from the graphics, the shipped game was lifeless and uninteresting, Morrowind was orders of magnitude more original, more interesting and (even though it was on a half-dead continent) more full of life than Oblivion.

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#112

Post by iwwr »

Devilboy wrote: post #75
rorrr wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bet more of the art will be procedurally generated.

How about scanning real-world locations? That should save loads of time.

Fallen Earth MMO is based on real topographic maps of the Grand Canyon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallen_Earth

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#113

Post by hackinthebochs »

jaysonelliot wrote: post #67

This may be an unfashionable point to raise, but as the line continues to blur between CG and live action, we need to check the ethics of the content we're producing. When I play a racing game for several hours, I have to check myself before I get behind the wheel of a real car. What does it do to the mind of a twelve year old to not just see hundreds of graphic acts of violence, but to control them over and over aga…

Too bad for the downvotes. Even though we like to pretend this isn't an issue, this point really needs to be addressed. When graphics become a mirror image of reality what does that do for our subconscious to be continually acting out violent acts on real-looking people? I know we like to deny it, but there is a desensitizing effect that violent images has on our subconscious. True to life graphics will probably make the effect even stronger. Where do we draw the line? Should there be a line?

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#114

Post by jaysonelliot »

hackinthebochs wrote: post #113
jaysonelliot wrote: post #67

This may be an unfashionable point to raise, but as the line continues to blur between CG and live action, we need to check the ethics of the content we're producing. When I play a racing game for several hours, I have to check myself before I get behind the wheel of a real car. What does it do to the mind of a twelve year old to not just see hundreds of graphic acts of violence, but to control them over and over aga…

Too bad for the downvotes. Even though we like to pretend this isn't an issue, this point really needs to be addressed. When graphics become a mirror image of reality what does that do for our subconscious to be continually acting out violent acts on real-looking people? I know we like to deny it, but there is a desensitizing effect that violent images has on our subconscious. True to life graphics will probably make…

I appreciate the comment. I think the current kneejerk reaction against violence in video games is uninformed and ideological, but that doesn't mean we should never consider the consequences of technology as it advances.

Is a game of GTA on the PS3 going to turn a rational adult into a criminal? Of course not.

Is there a difference between the developing brain of a child immersed in a simulation, and a grownup playing a game? I don't think that's unreasonable to ask.

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#115

Post by chadgeidel »

jaysonelliot wrote: post #67

This may be an unfashionable point to raise, but as the line continues to blur between CG and live action, we need to check the ethics of the content we're producing. When I play a racing game for several hours, I have to check myself before I get behind the wheel of a real car. What does it do to the mind of a twelve year old to not just see hundreds of graphic acts of violence, but to control them over and over aga…

It's not only unfashionable, it's downright wrong. Studies have shown there is no link between "entertainment" (like comic books, movies, and games) and real-life behavior.

Please stop raising this old canard.

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#116

Post by pragmatic »

What Next-Gen Consoles?

Sony and MSFT didn't do that well on this generation.

> Collectively, that means that 2011, on the console side, is going to be relatively drab. Microsoft doesn't need a new console, Nintendo doesn't want to compete with the 3DS launch, and Sony can't afford a new console. So it seems like the only points of interest this year will be price cuts--certainly, Sony and Nintendo will have them.

http://dubiousquality.blogspot.com/2011/01/console-post-of-w...

There are no plans for a future generation, aside from Nintendo, which _might_ have a full HD console. (Please correct me if I'm wrong).

> The demo ran on a PC with an Intel Core i9 microprocessor with three Nvidia GeForce 580 GTX graphics cards connected through SLI technology. The demo took about three months for 12 programmers and artists to build.

It's on a huge, hot, expensive PC now, how would the big 3 recoup their investment in such a beast? Wouldn't they be better off trying to sell portable units with cheaper to produce games?

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#117

Post by cma »

Devilboy wrote: post #76
malkia wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because it scales with the number of cores, it does not mean it would keep fps in reasonable range given random camera position and orientation. Take a look at Intel's raytracing demo, and when you go close to the lamps (shiny bulby spherical objects with lots of reflections) you get a lot of slowdown (using same amount of cpus). That's what I'm talking about. Yes you can tweak it, but it loses it's purpose.

That's easy to work around, you just stop computing once you hit your time limit on that pixel. It'll be good enough.

If every pixel takes too long you get nothing; plus you wasted computing power to find out.

A different solution is to cast a sparser set of rays as things slow down, and then use compressed sensing (which has a runtime complexity independent of scene complexity) to integrate the full scene. Then as the scene gets more complex, you get what (visually) amounts to a heavily compressed jpeg.

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#118

Post by hackinthebochs »

chadgeidel wrote: post #115
jaysonelliot wrote: post #67

This may be an unfashionable point to raise, but as the line continues to blur between CG and live action, we need to check the ethics of the content we're producing. When I play a racing game for several hours, I have to check myself before I get behind the wheel of a real car. What does it do to the mind of a twelve year old to not just see hundreds of graphic acts of violence, but to control them over and over aga…

It's not only unfashionable, it's downright wrong. Studies have shown there is no link between "entertainment" (like comic books, movies, and games) and real-life behavior. Please stop raising this old canard.

I'd like to see some of these studies you cite. I'd wager you're drawing a far stronger conclusion than the studies warrant. Even a very tiny effect, while inconsequential in an individual, can have an impact on the scale of an entire culture.

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#119

Post by xsmasher »

jaysonelliot wrote: post #67

This may be an unfashionable point to raise, but as the line continues to blur between CG and live action, we need to check the ethics of the content we're producing. When I play a racing game for several hours, I have to check myself before I get behind the wheel of a real car. What does it do to the mind of a twelve year old to not just see hundreds of graphic acts of violence, but to control them over and over aga…

Can you clarify your point? Is it unethical to make content for adults because children might see it?

I would say it's unethical for parents to abdicte their gatekeeper responsibilities to the clerk at gamestop.

Re: Epic Games shows jaw-dropping graphics for next-generation consoles

#120

Post by jaysonelliot »

chadgeidel wrote: post #115
jaysonelliot wrote: post #67

This may be an unfashionable point to raise, but as the line continues to blur between CG and live action, we need to check the ethics of the content we're producing. When I play a racing game for several hours, I have to check myself before I get behind the wheel of a real car. What does it do to the mind of a twelve year old to not just see hundreds of graphic acts of violence, but to control them over and over aga…

It's not only unfashionable, it's downright wrong. Studies have shown there is no link between "entertainment" (like comic books, movies, and games) and real-life behavior. Please stop raising this old canard.

I'm sorry, but you're missing my point entirely.

I'm not talking about reading a violent comic book, or watching a movie, or even playing one of the current generation of video games. Please re-read what I wrote.

My question is about whether we should consider ethics as technology advances. If we reach the point that we can create realistic simulations, and then put children into those simulations, do we have any responsibility for the content of those simulations?

Please don't be so ideological about the issue. It should never be wrong to question things.

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