Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

newsweek.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 174 posts

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#111

Post by jshevek »

ajross wrote: post #92
jshevek wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both [your observation and mine] are true. I am not talking about mainstream scientists. Sadly, they don't control the larger conversations.

> I am not talking about mainstream scientists. Then who are you talking about?

> Then who are you talking about?

This question is so strange I don't know where to begin. Should I look up the percentage of the population that are scientists? Should I pull up an Amazon list of books popular in the 70s and 80s dealing with climate change? Should I start listing various forms of dysfunction in the 4th estate? Should we talk about the culture of activists?

Disseminating scientific knowledge correctly is a challenge in our society.

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#112

Post by btilly »

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #27
keeganjw wrote: post #15

They make a good point in this article, I just wish Newsweek and other media outlets would get this pissed off about climate change. "Old and unafraid of the climate crisis? Good for you. Now stop killing future generations." If we're mobilizing to stop a pandemic, why the hell aren't we mobilizing to stop climate change? I know this is going to get downvoted into oblivion, I just wanted to say it.

I was making a related comment to my coworkers earlier this week: if the stock market is this freaked about covid19, just wait til investors realize climate change is real and it will be hard to make money while NYC is flooded and nobody wants to buy oil anymore.

When you say things like this, you come across as uninformed. Not smart.

Seriously, https://riskfinder.climatecentral.org/place/new-york.ny.us?c... shows you the worst projected flood in the next 30 years. As you can see, there is substantial damage, but the vast majority of New York will be fine.

And mitigation of that particular risk is available at a relatively cheap price of building dykes. Which is well-understood technology. In fact there is a country (the Netherlands) that in large part consists of reclaimed seabed kept dry through dykes.

About oil, oil isn't most of our economy. Believe it or not, people realize this and it won't actually change our economic system as much as you seem to think it will.

So yes, climate change is a real problem. But "OMG, NEW YORK IS ABOUT TO BE FLOODED AND OUR ECONOMY WILL END WITH OIL" is not supported by the evidence.

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#113

Post by opwieurposiu »

keeganjw wrote: post #15

They make a good point in this article, I just wish Newsweek and other media outlets would get this pissed off about climate change. "Old and unafraid of the climate crisis? Good for you. Now stop killing future generations." If we're mobilizing to stop a pandemic, why the hell aren't we mobilizing to stop climate change? I know this is going to get downvoted into oblivion, I just wanted to say it.

Fewer people means less carbon emissions. More people means more carbon emissions.

On the other hand, fewer people means lower oil prices, which increases carbon emissions.

Hard to say what the net effect will be.

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#114

Post by balls187 »

brianTheDog wrote: post #98
tdhoot wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do we also owe it to the immunocompromised? Yes? For example, get your vaccines so those who cannot get them have herd immunity.

Ah so people should have free will taken away.

Yes. That happens routinely, usually but not always, if society deems your free will is a threat to it.

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#115

Post by jshevek »

ajross wrote: post #90
jshevek wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of the problem here is that extremists have subjected us to at least three decades of climate alarmism poisoned by bad science and failed predictions. People who lack the scientific background to properly understand specific claims and the basis for them rely on ignorant heuristics, such as "the boy who cried wolf". They wrongly conclude that the current round of climate concern is no different than the rounds t…

> extremists have subjected us to at least three decades of climate alarmism poisoned by bad science and failed predictions. I'm sure someone said something dumb. But straightforward models of long term climate change and CO2 output going back to the 70's have all been largely proven out. Which "extremists" are you trying to point the finger at, specifically?

> I'm sure someone said something dumb

Yes, just one person.

Edit: I try not to engage with people who use this kind of rhetorical technique. If anyone else is honestly ignorant of and curious about the damaging effects that decades of climate alarmism has had on some people's trust, you need only Google. For example: "bad climate change predictions"

In my opinion, the problem still exists and it is important to be honest about the elements (activists, journalists, politicians) who are on the 'right side' of the discussion but do a poor job of representing the data.

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#116

Post by celdon25 »

atoav wrote: post #81
chrisco255 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody is dying from global warming. It's a sea level rise of 2-3mm a year. Less than 11,000 people a year die from natural disasters, which is near all-time lows despite a rising population. 100 years ago, it was common for at least 1,000,000 people a year to die from natural disasters. Thanks to technology, including internal combustion vehicles and electricity, that number has dropped dramatically. Crop yields are…

> Nobody is dying from global warming. Citation needed. Many (also old) people died in the European heat waves of the last summer. And every year these summers are getting hotter. Once crops closer to the already dry and hot areas of the globe stop to yield, and people migrate away from those areas — how many people die in the resulting conflicts, how much human suffering will be produced there? What impact will the…

Good points, but:

> On top of that: the ddcisions we take now could potentially be multiplied by the next 1000 human generations, only idiots would take that risk lightly.

The problem with this is that the decisions we take now could potentially mean anything. The butterfly effect effectively makes it meaningless to measure what we do now, so many years into the future. There's a lot of sentiment against climate change "denial", but the real denial is not about the presence of climate change but rather whether it is wise to make changes that we cannot measure the impact of.

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#117

Post by jshevek »

brianTheDog wrote: post #98
tdhoot wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do we also owe it to the immunocompromised? Yes? For example, get your vaccines so those who cannot get them have herd immunity.

Ah so people should have free will taken away.

I thought people were advocating for responsible behavior, not enforcement.

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#118

Post by shawnb576 »

chrisco255 wrote: post #41
keeganjw wrote: post #15

They make a good point in this article, I just wish Newsweek and other media outlets would get this pissed off about climate change. "Old and unafraid of the climate crisis? Good for you. Now stop killing future generations." If we're mobilizing to stop a pandemic, why the hell aren't we mobilizing to stop climate change? I know this is going to get downvoted into oblivion, I just wanted to say it.

Nobody is dying from global warming. It's a sea level rise of 2-3mm a year. Less than 11,000 people a year die from natural disasters, which is near all-time lows despite a rising population. 100 years ago, it was common for at least 1,000,000 people a year to die from natural disasters. Thanks to technology, including internal combustion vehicles and electricity, that number has dropped dramatically. Crop yields are…

> Nobody is dying from global warming.

This is definitely not true now and will be less true in future. And its a very narrow view - climate change is spreading misery and destruction at massive scales.

- More powerful hurricanes and cyclones kill people directly then many more through disease, starvation, homelessness, etc.

- The Australian fires killed 1 BILLION animals. [1]

- India is running out of water [3]

- Ocean fish stocks are collapsing - leading to malnutrition and starvation of many who depend on them

- Global heating is driving conflicts and migration from places like central america, middle east, etc.

- While not climate change, the cause of it (fossil fuels) causes 10K deaths EVERY DAY [2]

[1] https://www.cbsnews.com/news/australia-fires-over-1-billion-... [2] https://www.forbes.com/sites/rogerpielke/2020/03/10/every-da... [3] https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/15/opinion/india-water-crisi...

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#119

Post by tasuki »

antonzabirko wrote: post #16
stetrain wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is that young people are more likely to think "Oh this won't affect me, I'll continue as normal" because the severity and mortality of this illness is statistically higher for older people. I don't see it as blaming young people, just pointing out that even if you aren't in the statistically "at risk" part of the age curve, you can still play a part in the spread and effects of this epidemic.

The article should've shed light on what govts can do better, not what individuals can. That's where the blame lies.

Really? Individuals can't do things? Only governments can?

It's so easy to just blame the government...

Re: Young and unafraid of the pandemic? Good for you. Now stop killing people

#120

Post by maximente »

why isn't the author pointing fingers at the EU?

Italy cannot control its own currency so it's at the behest of the ECB when it comes to supporting banks, citizen bail outs, etc. the ECB is still in "monitoring mode", whatever that means. also recall Italy has been in various austerity-like periods for some time now. is Brussels sending in staff and building emergency facilities to help out its struggling member?

so what gives? is the ECB going to backstop Italian banks/businesses? directly inject capital a la what the US Federal Reserve ostensibly could (will) do? how about other member nations e.g. Germany?

Post reply on HN