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Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

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Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#111

Post by alpineidyll3 »

safog wrote: post #23

Come on man, there's no where near enough volume there to move anything but the most low volume of stocks. All they trade in is meme stocks like TSLA, NFLX, MSFT, AAPL etc., and a few 100k on calls here or there won't budge the price in the slightest. On top of that, it's not even a P&D group, people there are just trading against each other, you have both bears and bulls and thetas. There's never been a concerted ef…

As Matt correctly points out ppl who work in finance like me cannot look away from wsb. Everyone follows the garbage fire, so it's actually kinda real!

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#112

Post by remote_phone »

As someone who was a very early member of /r/wallstreetbets:

1) /r/wallstreetbets and /r/wsb are two different subreddits. /r/wsb are for those that got banned from wallstreetbets

2) When wallstreetbets first started it wasn’t as crazy as it was today. There were some aggressive gamblers but there was opportunity for real due diligence and decent conversation. I contributed more than a few posts back in the early days. After it got crazy I unsubscribed until recently. Robinhood and the options trading and margin trading has really made things crazy. I see absurd bets made on there that make me both jealous and glad I’m not 25 with too much money to gamble.

3) those who say it’s likely too small to make a difference go check out the timing of the Lumber Liquidator due diligence post and the subsequent jump in price. I don’t know what the difference is between pump and dump vs posting due diligence but there definitely was a correlation. I wish I still had my data account because I would love to see the exact correlation of options trading and stock trading to the posts.

4) the memes and gifs are hilarious if not vulgar and bigoted. But if you have thick skin some of the memes are very well made.

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#113

Post by jaywalk »

legitster wrote: post #46
shiftpgdn wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FYI: Since you're in the US you can drop the double opt in on your news letter. I'd setup your page to feed to an Excel sheet or something and use that to feed into your email sending software.

This is bad advice: - Even if you are in the US, there is still some liability risk of EU recipients. Not super clear, but better safe than sorry. - Double Opt-in can improve email deliverability. Clutter folders are starting to detect and filter out emails with low engagements. An opt in email forces an engagement, and weeds out bad recipients. - It's a better all-around experience.

If you don't have a presence in the EU, there is zero liability regarding EU recipients. EU laws do not apply outside of the EU.

That being said, double opt-in is still a good idea regardless of the law.

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#114

Post by mrandish »

reaperducer wrote: post #95
asavadatti wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not trying to be a jerk but the phrase is "Case in point".

It's fine, for all intensive purposes. (This is what happens when a society stops reading books.)

By in large, you are correct.

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#115

Post by thaumasiotes »

greenie_beans wrote: post #75
safog wrote: post #23

Come on man, there's no where near enough volume there to move anything but the most low volume of stocks. All they trade in is meme stocks like TSLA, NFLX, MSFT, AAPL etc., and a few 100k on calls here or there won't budge the price in the slightest. On top of that, it's not even a P&D group, people there are just trading against each other, you have both bears and bulls and thetas. There's never been a concerted ef…

Matt Levine has an interesting take in his email newsletter that refutes your claim. Basically, by so many people buying calls, it forces market movers to purchase the underlying stock to cover their call and this perpetuates an upward movement.

That's the opposite of what he said. Look at his latest article:

> We have discussed this theory before, during Tesla’s wild rally, and I conceded that they’ve got a point. Not a perpetual motion machine, but a motion machine, sure. The machine runs on leverage. If you have $100, you can buy $100 worth of stock, and the stock will go up a little; your trade will be self-reinforcing. If you get a margin loan, you can buy $200 worth of stock, and the stock will go up a bit more; your trade will be a bit more self-reinforcing. On the other hand if the stock then goes down a bit, your broker might call more margin from you, and if you can’t put up more money the broker will liquidate your whole position and the stock will go down. Trading on margin magnifies swings

Or what he originally wrote:

> the call options should have a volatility-increasing effect: Dealers who sell call options have to buy stock to hedge, and they have to buy more stock to adjust their hedge as the stock goes up (and sell as it goes down), meaning that speculators who buy Tesla call options to bet on the price and volatility going up also to some extent cause that to happen. To some extent! “LOL BLOOMBERG ADMITTING THAT AS LONG AS WE BUY THE CALLS THE STOCKS WILL GO UP BECAUSE OF HEDGING ALGORITHMS,” was Reddit’s takeaway from Kawa’s article, and I would not personally go that far.

How do you get from Matt Levine saying "this cannot perpetuate an upward movement" and "other people are taking this to mean that the stocks will keep going up as long as we keep buying the calls, but those people are wrong" to "Matt Levine says this perpetuates an upward movement"? He made a direct, first-person statement of what he thinks, and you've inverted it.

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#116

Post by misterprime »

reaperducer wrote: post #95
asavadatti wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not trying to be a jerk but the phrase is "Case in point".

It's fine, for all intensive purposes. (This is what happens when a society stops reading books.)

I really could care less.

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#117

Post by mrandish »

safog wrote: post #23

Come on man, there's no where near enough volume there to move anything but the most low volume of stocks. All they trade in is meme stocks like TSLA, NFLX, MSFT, AAPL etc., and a few 100k on calls here or there won't budge the price in the slightest. On top of that, it's not even a P&D group, people there are just trading against each other, you have both bears and bulls and thetas. There's never been a concerted ef…

> there's no where near enough volume there to move anything

I was imagining that some big money quant fund had written bots and scrapers to use r/wsb as an algorithmic amplifier since over time they can make money on tiny shifts. Or maybe that would just make a good movie plot.

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#118

Post by godelski »

alexpotato wrote: post #35

Back in the early 2000's I worked for a company that was was hired (via intermediary law firms) by publicly listed companies to investigate pump and dump schemes on Yahoo message boards (you might call that the "Reddit of the early 2000's"). It involved a lot of web scraping Yahoo with Perl (specifically LWP) and then lots of analysis by humans with some help from automated tools. For example, if you plotted a histog…

But was P&D happening?

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#119

Post by aaron695 »

jcrites wrote: post #55
cdiamand wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the heads up. Reenabled!

Good choice. Just to elaborate: double opt-in is expected behavior from customer-centric companies, and expected behavior from good actors in the email ecosystem. It's not necessarily required by law in the US, but it's a good practice nonetheless: always make sure you have permission from a recipient to send an email. Anyone can pass anyone else's email address as input to a form, so simply receiving an address as i…

> I consider single-opt-in use of email addresses to be a dark pattern or anti-pattern

This is wrong.

I want to be able to enter an email address and get a newsletter. This is good UI/UX blah

There is nothing dark about helping a user using single opt in. Single opt in is great and preferred.

But because of the world we live in, as you explain well, we have to make everyone's lives a PiTA by securing it.

It might be a anti-pattern collecting emails to easily, since the Spam Bots might punish you because of bad actors, which reduces your email reach.

But it's also a anti-pattern to think double opt in is normal. If you can get away with not doing it, then don't. ie. I see idiots doing it in corporate settings or after having paid money

Re: Reddit’s profane, greedy traders are shaking up the stock market

#120

Post by FilterSweep »

safog wrote: post #23

Come on man, there's no where near enough volume there to move anything but the most low volume of stocks. All they trade in is meme stocks like TSLA, NFLX, MSFT, AAPL etc., and a few 100k on calls here or there won't budge the price in the slightest. On top of that, it's not even a P&D group, people there are just trading against each other, you have both bears and bulls and thetas. There's never been a concerted ef…

There are also a few hardened investment professionals on there who will throw bad picks just to watch the fallout
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