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Education and Men without Work

nationalaffairs.com

111–120 of 342 posts

Re: Education and Men without Work

#111

As unpopular it may be to say such a politically incorrect thing (admitting this is a generalization, and all the caveats that come with it) -- Men generally have the biological need to go do and wander and discover things. I don't know whether it's hormones or what. Debate all you like elsewhere (I'm not trying to debate that point here). My point is that when they don't get an outlet to do this, they cause trouble.…

As a counterpoint to the many people replying against your general point that men have a stronge urge to adventure, I will go ahead and say that I agree with you. Just looking at the outcomes of history, the number of male explorers, warriors, and adventurers strongly supports the case.

There are some psychological differences between men and women that are intuitively obvious, and well researched in psychology, but get people riled up. As a standard disclaimer- this is all on average, and individuals vary greatly. I would figure that men's greater aggressiveness corroborates an adventuresome nature.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_differences_in_psychology#...

Re: Education and Men without Work

#112
post #108

The article is long on detail and short on suggestions (which is understandable). However, the suggestions it does make are not obviously going to work. The men illustrated in the article do not seem incapable of work, but rather disinterested. Vocational training isn't going to fix the fact that the government benefits the article cited allows the men to stay at home playing video games all day. Most people (but esp…

It is a well written article for presenting facts. The lack of solutions is welcome to me; and I recall that the word 'crisis' is closer to meaning an unstable situation than an actual problem. The big open question here is what exactly should these people doing instead? 'Getting a job' is meaningless in itself - it isn't an end goal like 'secure my family's future'. If someone can survive comfortably without working…

> If someone can survive comfortably without working then that is exactly what they should be doing; work isn't especially fun unless someone is a bit lucky with what they enjoy.

As someone planning on retiring early, I completely agree, but these men are dependent on government benefits, which, being taken from my paycheck, are lengthening the amount of time I have before I can retire.

Re: Education and Men without Work

#113

As unpopular it may be to say such a politically incorrect thing (admitting this is a generalization, and all the caveats that come with it) -- Men generally have the biological need to go do and wander and discover things. I don't know whether it's hormones or what. Debate all you like elsewhere (I'm not trying to debate that point here). My point is that when they don't get an outlet to do this, they cause trouble.…

"Men generally have the biological need to go do and wander and discover things." I see no evidence that this is a male thing, versus a female thing, or even that all men feel this. I see plenty of men who just coast through life with no curiosity or drive. They don't explore or discover, they just consume and do what they're told so they can consume some more.

> I see no evidence that this is a male thing, versus a female thing

I’ve yet to see a valid generalization for men that did not hold for women. Though sometimes the perspective changes.

Re: Education and Men without Work

#114

The article is long on detail and short on suggestions (which is understandable). However, the suggestions it does make are not obviously going to work. The men illustrated in the article do not seem incapable of work, but rather disinterested. Vocational training isn't going to fix the fact that the government benefits the article cited allows the men to stay at home playing video games all day. Most people (but esp…

Also not discussed is the impact of unlimited access to pornography for sexual gratification on the reduction in male desire to do things that traditionally would attract women.

Yes, absolutely!

Re: Education and Men without Work

#115

The article is long on detail and short on suggestions (which is understandable). However, the suggestions it does make are not obviously going to work. The men illustrated in the article do not seem incapable of work, but rather disinterested. Vocational training isn't going to fix the fact that the government benefits the article cited allows the men to stay at home playing video games all day. Most people (but esp…

I'd rather the losers of society stay in their house, high and playing video games, rather than trying to impress women and provide a family legacy by engaging in gangster behavior to get money. Also, if society is so plentiful that it can handle a certain percentage of people doing nothing but living for pleasure, why not let them? Work is not valuable except for its product, and if its product is not needed, the wo…

I used to believe that work was only there for what it produced, but now know that that's wrong. Being useful is very important for mental well-being. It gives happiness and reduces anxiety and depression. When I was unemployed, I did volunteer work to keep my spirits up. It's important for people to work or otherwise have some purpose beyond personal pleasure.

Re: Education and Men without Work

#116
I am trying to figure out when people will realize that a society without healthy men taking charge and pushing forward is a dying society. It's even more obvious when we see other countries whose feminization of men has actually led to the decline of their population.

Reading the sterile, cerebral responses here is a bit disconcerting, but expected given the participating audience, because "smart" people assume that our mind is remotely capable of understanding the balance behind what pushes analog, real life forward.

Populations grow and prosper when their men are ALLOWED to be motivated to go out there and kick some ass. Whether it's money, women, etc... our reward centers operate on concrete, tangible stuff. It does NOT feel motivated by the premise of peace and longevity. This is great for low-testosterone men who are more than happy to abide by the rules for a little crumb of bread and some monthly semi-erect action.

For fuck's sake, stop being so goddamn cerebral. I am extremely cerebral, I write and sell exploits for popular software and perform red team operations for a living. Yes, I can reason my way through shit, but nobody realizes that the human brain is a naive, finite reasoning machine operating within a narrow framework of a seemingly infinite reality. Anyway, I lift, I eat right, I get laid frequently, I stay away from marriage, I work hard, REALLY hard, and I get the rewards that I expect, I'm happy and I'm fucking killing it.

A huge part of my dopamine production is because I make a ton of money, I get laid frequently, and I face physical challenges in the form of lifting/exercise.

We've been so cerebral and over-engineering society recently, we are literally killing ourselves as we delude ourselves into thinking we can engineer a 100% peaceful, civilized society of healthy individuals. We exist in an analog world, life is about survival. If for one second you think you can escape nature's law, you are deluded.

The law of nature doesn't throw you in a prison cell when you break its rules due to misunderstanding, it throws you in a state of deep depression, disjoint from reality, unmotivated to the point of eventually taking your own life.

This is what happens when you over-govern a man. When you tell him "society only needs a small percentage of men." Do you really think we're going to escape the "animalistic" bullshit? Keep dreaming buddy. Our minds live in nature, and nature does not live in our minds. We tried, with different iterations of religions, to find a good compromise by encouraging women to be chaste and men to be respectable, but we've let one side of this equation slip tremendously. But that story is for a different day.

We need to realize what's going on and loosen the strap around men's nuts. Most of them aren't capable of flipping everyone off and using your resources to your advantage. In fact, the majority of men probably CAN'T, but we can't kill the dream, we need to encourage this behavior to truly make groundbreaking advancements.

You don't innovate and move forward when you over-govern. You don't move forward when you make Gods of weak individuals and protect them at all costs. This is how you serenade a society into a peaceful, purposeless, pillful depression. Wake the fuck up!

I 100% expect this to be downvoted, but I hope I've reached at least one other person to wake up and break out of the system.

Re: Education and Men without Work

#117

The article is long on detail and short on suggestions (which is understandable). However, the suggestions it does make are not obviously going to work. The men illustrated in the article do not seem incapable of work, but rather disinterested. Vocational training isn't going to fix the fact that the government benefits the article cited allows the men to stay at home playing video games all day. Most people (but esp…

> stay at home playing video games all day Playing video games is monumentally boring after a short while. I just can't understand people who disappear into them. Even the game I wrote for myself ( classicempire.com ) I rarely actually played, I'd spend my time trying to make the computer AI play better.

I also can't understand it, life is fun and video games get boring pretty quickly. But that's probably why I am not staying at home playing video games all day.

Re: Education and Men without Work

#118
post #38

> According to the latest monthly jobs report from the Bureau of Labor Statistics, "work rates" for American men in October 2019 stood very close to their 1939 levels, as reported in the 1940 U.S. Census. Despite some improvement since the end of the Great Recession, Great Depression-style work rates are still characteristic today for the American male, both for those of "prime working age" (defined as ages 25 to 54)…

> Investor, entrepreneur, contractor

Those would be all self employed wouldn't they? I am more interested to know how much engage in shadow economy to sustain themselves

Re: Education and Men without Work

#119

As unpopular it may be to say such a politically incorrect thing (admitting this is a generalization, and all the caveats that come with it) -- Men generally have the biological need to go do and wander and discover things. I don't know whether it's hormones or what. Debate all you like elsewhere (I'm not trying to debate that point here). My point is that when they don't get an outlet to do this, they cause trouble.…

What you're saying doesn't make sense. We have right to work states that can hire you and fire you all in the same hour.

What is this 'constrained legal and regulatory calculus'?

I've worked as 1099 and my company literally just gave me a check. Zero overhead. And that's an option everywhere in America.

For W2 employees you can outsource your H.R. to ADP for 200 bucks a month for 10-15 employees.

This appears outright wrong and reeks of having an agenda especially because no sources were cited

Re: Education and Men without Work

#120
post #38

> According to the latest monthly jobs report from the Bureau of Labor Statistics, "work rates" for American men in October 2019 stood very close to their 1939 levels, as reported in the 1940 U.S. Census. Despite some improvement since the end of the Great Recession, Great Depression-style work rates are still characteristic today for the American male, both for those of "prime working age" (defined as ages 25 to 54)…

Labor force participation rate. It says in the article.
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