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Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

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Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#111

Post by chewz »

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

> Yet another reason to advocate for privacy,

Take a taxi, pay with cash. Private.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#112

Post by rdiddly »

Enginerrrd wrote: post #100
brightball wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would likely lead to people working harder to find better prices. I moved into a nice house that was about to be foreclosed a couple of years back and after moving in, we had to get some of the same things done that we’d had at our previous home. The quotes were usually 2-3x higher for the exact same job.

This isn't all exploitative. I used to work trades and we regularly found the richer clients to be absolute PITA's about super minor details. They were the first ones to threaten not to pay unless we redid a big thing and also wouldn't offer to compensate for any phase of that.

Maybe if you charged them less they'd sweat the details less?

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#113

Post by o-__-o »

trimbo wrote: post #88
6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

I mean, do you own a nice house or car? If you do, you've already experienced this sizing-up. A contractor comes to the house and sees you can afford 2x what they'd normally charge. A mechanic for your Lexus charges N times as much as the same mechanic would for your Toyota, even though they're the same parts and manufacturer.

Had an Audi, did the work myself. Audi parts are not VW parts just like Porsche parts are not Audi parts! I think a relay or a few hoses were shared across the car companies but nothing to write home about.. Second Audi’s are heavier than their VW counterpart so they needed stronger equipment. Made and shipped from Europe. Third, Audi had a tighter build process so a lot more work had to be done before a similar task on a VW (timing belt comes to mind). The same exists for Lexus/Toyota, Ford/Lincoln, Nissan/Infiniti.

What I’m saying is your nice house may cost 2x because your nice house has nice things that increase labor costs. Just like that upsized vehicle manufacturer..

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#114

Post by cambalache »

suyash wrote: post #78
mcrae wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t price discrimination embedded in nearly every transaction we engage in, though? What is the difference between price discrimination between classes of individuals (to your point, business vs leisure travellers), and individuals themselves? Nearly every pricing guide on this site recommends offering an ‘invoiced’ pricing plan for enterprises for substantially more than the same service on credit card billing. Pr…

No, go to amazon.com and look for your favorite product, now tell me if 10 people from different income level see that, will the price be diffferent?

Probably a very high percentage of items(90% I am pulling things out my ass) are NOT price discriminated. Food, electronics, many many transportation fares (buses, subways), you get the money you pay the same regardless of your net value or income. People love to be contrarian, that's all.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#115

Post by Baltasaur »

umvi wrote: post #107
spats1990 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you expand on why you think so? 1. I'm driving at 110 kph when the limit is 100. I pay $80, but I got paid $16000 after tax this month. 2. I'm driving at 110 kph when the limit is 100. I pay $80, but I got paid $4000 after tax this month. Fair?

Yes, that's fair. Please explain why you believe it is not fair. 1. I'm climbing a tree when I ought not to and fall and break my legs. I'm a poor construction worker which means I am now out of work. 2. I'm climbing a tree when I ought not to and fall and break my legs. I'm a wealthy programmer and just keep on going to work since my hands and brain still work fine. Fair? Or should the tree break my hands and give m…

This is such a colossally bad take. Tickets have the distinct purpose of disincentivizing dangerous driving. They don't do that if it's a flat fare and the person breaking the speed limit is sufficiently wealthy. Thus, if you want speeding tickets to affect everyone equally, you make them proportional.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#116

Post by awinter-py »

If two companies that have been operating at a loss for N years simultaneously stop, is it price collusion?

There are lots of factors here that could drive a decision to raise prices: both went public this year = increased scrutiny, moviepass & wework fiascoes = decreased tolerance for bad business models, driverless experiments have failed.

But it also feels like there's a wink happening.

If the DOJ / courts takeaway is 'yes it's collusion and they're getting slapped with a company-killing fine', it has interesting implications for the ability of unicorns to operate at a loss for long periods.

Effectively banning negative unit economics for large companies would be a new chapter for the startup economy.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#117

Post by smacktoward »

seriesf wrote: post #41
heavyset_go wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Uber model relies on an underclass whose need for cash right now overrides any concerns they might have down the line about vehicle depreciation, the consequences of operating a taxi on a consumer insurance plan, the high self-employment tax burden, health insurance or actually breaking even after taking those factors into account.

I'm assuming the population of dupes will eventually be depleted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There%27s_a_sucker_born_every_...

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#118

Post by mathgeek »

umvi wrote: post #107
spats1990 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you expand on why you think so? 1. I'm driving at 110 kph when the limit is 100. I pay $80, but I got paid $16000 after tax this month. 2. I'm driving at 110 kph when the limit is 100. I pay $80, but I got paid $4000 after tax this month. Fair?

Yes, that's fair. Please explain why you believe it is not fair. 1. I'm climbing a tree when I ought not to and fall and break my legs. I'm a poor construction worker which means I am now out of work. 2. I'm climbing a tree when I ought not to and fall and break my legs. I'm a wealthy programmer and just keep on going to work since my hands and brain still work fine. Fair? Or should the tree break my hands and give m…

> Or should the tree break my hands and give me a concussion on the way down in order to level the playing field?

This is a straw man argument. It would be a decent allegory for jail terms that favor the rich, though.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#119

Post by cortic »

suyash wrote: post #77
blululu wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Discriminatory pricing feels nasty when you're get the short end of the stick but any pricing scheme will have bias. Having a high wage earner pay the same fare for a service as a low wage earner gives a much better deal to the wealthier person. (In Finland traffic tickets are calculated as a percentage of your income) In many countries you will pay a surcharge if merchants think that you are wealthier since it impli…

Finland traffic tickets sounds like a horrible idea.

I think it sounds like a great idea, admittedly though it is difficult for me to get my head around a system that isn't unfairly gracious to the wealthy and vicious to the poor.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#120

Post by Barrin92 »

wilde wrote: post #99
Barrin92 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Pretty crazy with Juul, WeWork, DoorDash, and Uber / Lyft all struggling Given that the entire value-added of a company like Uber is getting a taxi to you slightly faster it's not surprising at all. Uber didn't make cars cheaper, drivers faster or added productivity in any other way plus they have a gigantic and expensive tech overhead, so it was never at all clear to me how they're supposed to be both competitive a…

That’s an oversimplification. Uber’s primary innovations were social. They convinced riders that it was safe to jump into a stranger’s car, and drivers that it was safe to run an illegal taxi business. They managed to do both of these things effectively in large enough volumes to change how people think about taxis. Both of these things seem boring and normal now, but they were radical a decade ago.

that's not an innovation that captures any unique value for Uber and more of a positive externality if anything, because strangers still want to be paid and if anything customers aren't willing to pay them more than a regular taxi company.

On an economic level, if anything Uber suffers from inefficiencies because every driver being their own insurer, repairman and so on is a disdavantage compared to employment by a traditional taxi business. Which is of course why taxi drivers organise in firms to begin with. In a way, the entire sharing business model is a sort of weird backwards move that wilfully ignores the division of labour.

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