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Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

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Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#111

Post by Sir_Cmpwn »

rimliu wrote: post #108
Sir_Cmpwn wrote: post #33

Lots of Apple apologists in this thread. (1) They deliberately design new proprietary adapters, eschewing already popular and capable standards, in new devices - to sell you more shit (2) They remove support for existing standards (e.g. headphone jacks) - to sell you more shit (3) They file lawsuits against third-party repair providers who do a demonstrably better job than first-party repairs - to sell you more shit…

> They remove support for existing standards (e.g. headphone > jacks) - to sell you more shit Except that your phone comes with already compatible earbuds.

Right, which they gave you for free out of the grace of their hearts. It came out of the sticker price and will cost you when you lose or have to replace them or decide you don't like them (which you won't, because to Apple fans it's a status symbol more than anything of practical value).

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#112

Post by Sir_Cmpwn »

benzoate wrote: post #110
Sir_Cmpwn wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lightning, sure. How about firewire, and thunderbolt, and the 30-pin connectors for the iPod? Have you also forgotten their proprietary SSD connectors - SATA compatible but with a non-M.2 socket. Or ADC, a proprietary pinout for what's effectively a DVI cable? Or AAUI? Mini-VGA and Mini-DVI? Apple has been doing this for longer than I've been alive. I'm happy that they're phasing it out in favor of USB-C - this is a…

To my knowledge those described have some distinct advantage over what was available on the market at the time. Firewire was way faster, ADC carries USB, Thunderbolt is connected to PCIe, mini-vga and mini-dvi are self explanatory and their proprietary SATA like connection was, again, way faster.

Their proprietary SATA was just SATA with a wrong connector. It was not faster. Firewire was faster at the expense of massive security holes. A practical reason for having Thunderbolt connected to PCIe never materialized. Don't kid yourself - Apple made these calls for one reason and one reason only.

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#113

Post by turk73 »

kuzehanka wrote: post #59
kemayo wrote: post #11

> By activating a dormant software lock on their newest iPhones, Apple is effectively announcing a drastic new policy: only Apple batteries can go in iPhones, and only they can install them. I really dislike the phrasing attached to this story. It's not a lock: a third party installed battery still works , the phone isn't refusing to start up until you go to an Apple Store and have an authentic Apple(tm) battery inst…

No. That's exactly what Apple are doing. Out of all the ways they could harm the consumer in this situation, that message is by far the most effective. Stop defending them. Stop giving them benefit of doubt. Stop misconstruing their malice for incompetence. Apple has repeatedly demonstrated that they'll go to extreme lengths to harm consumers and prevent 3rd party repair. That message destroys the consumer's trust in…

Yeah, uh, BMW sucks and so a lot of auto makers. Instead of making an additional menu in the ridiculously over-complicated dashboard computer system, I had to buy a $150 tool that can do a "battery registration" so that the smart alternator knows that there's a new battery installed and not to charge it so much. You don't have to buy BMW brand batteries, though. But Jesus BMW, get over yourselves. There could be a button right by the battery in the trunk to do this, it doesn't have to all be locked down.

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#114

Post by sumedh »

sjwright wrote: post #6
godelski wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with this sentiment. You mention Rossmann. Anyone that watches his channel knows that Apple purposefully makes things hard to repair. Things could be easier if they wanted them to be. But it's clear that Apple doesn't want devices repaired. See Rossmann talk about prices and how often the genius bar just suggests replacement. As for third party repair, it isn't Apples fault if a third party repairs a phone…

I disagree with your sentiment, because it assumes that Rossmann can read the minds of Apple product designers and warranty service managers. The "Rossmann" method of device repair might be useful for short term disaster recovery, consumer asset loss mitigation and data recovery, but how reliable are his repairs long term? We never know. How scalable is this method of repair across thousand of cities? Probably very p…

> but how reliable are his repairs long term?

So the alternative is to listen to Apple's advice and buy a new device just because they think the device cannot be repaired?

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#115

Post by michaelt »

ChickeNES wrote: post #26
bubblethink wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You're going to want to know if it has OEM parts. But the message is triggered even if you insert an Apple part. So you would want to know if the phone was blessed by an apple genius when you buy/sell ? It's surprising the lengths people go through to defend these asinine decisions. I don't even care about Apple, but the problem is that everyone will follow suit since the rest of the industry lacks any sort of visio…

That's to prevent people from taking old batteries and modifying them to appear new. >So you would want to know if the phone was blessed by an apple genius when you buy/sell ? Very much so, I don't want my phone catching fire in my pocket or while charging, or people with little technical knowledge being scammed. Would you want to know if the home you were buying was wired by a licensed electrician, designed by a lic…

  That's to prevent people from
  taking old batteries and
  modifying them to appear new.
Strange that, for all their security chops, Apple can't make or buy a battery fuel gauge with a trustworthy cycle count.

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#116

Post by pranau »

auggierose wrote: post #78
hobofan wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Notifications that can't be dismissed or are recurring without a way to turn them off are one of the most annoying things about current operating systems, and Apple is one of the worst offenders. On my Macbook, I currently get: - A request to log in to Facetime every time I restart it (I've never used Facetime, and don't intend to, and have lost access to my AppleId) - A daily recurring notification to update my OS,…

Seriously, running an Apple OS without an Apple ID doesn't make any sense.

If you had made the same statement but replaced Apple with Google or Microsoft, your comment would have been downvoted to death already.

You shouldn't need an online ID to use a laptop. It makes perfect sense to use it without any sort of manufacturer provided profile.

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#117

Post by viraptor »

sjwright wrote: post #80
viraptor wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're bringing up how much Apple already spend on custom engineering. I agree - and that's why they should be called out as one of the first. And if people think Apple praises their design more - same. Repairability should be connected to good design. Also, if I'm in the PC environment, I can get a different repairable PC. If I'm in Mac environment... ?

Google is the most popular smartphone platform. That's why they should be called out first. Samsung makes the most number of handsets. That's why they should be called out first. Apple likes their products to look pretty. That's why they should be called out first. Microsoft is a convicted monopolist. That's why they should be called out first. Xiaomi are evil Chinese copycats. That's why they should be called out fi…

Then please do. Instead of doing this in comments about one company releasing anti-repair tech, post your information about the others. List their issues. Summarise why their products are hostile to third party support. Help people make informed decisions.

"There are other companies just as bad" is whataboutism, not informative.

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#118

Post by michaelt »

stock_toaster wrote: post #97
temporaryvector wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We already went through all of this with cars and car mechanics. The only difference with electronics is that people have been convinced that their smartphone, laptop and electronics in general are somehow arcane magic. Nowadays, car manufacturers also seem keen to jump on this bandwagon, since it would also benefit their bottom line to keep third party mechanics from touching their cars. Fact is, if Apple can fix th…

> We already went through all of this with cars and car mechanics From what I understand, phone batteries are far more energy dense (lithium ion) than car batteries (lead acid still?), and you carry them in your pocket. Maybe EV car batteries packs are more comparable? Remember when samsung phones were catching fire all over just a couple years ago? Wasn't that due to some weird assembly/manufacturing issue where the…

Cars generally have tanks full of gasoline, though, which is even more energy-dense than lithium ion batteries. Nonetheless, you can take your car to a third-party mechanic.

And I'd bet more people have been burned (or for that matter been killed) in car accidents than phone accidents.

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#119

Post by wingspar »

thedevilslawyer wrote: post #27
kemayo wrote: post #11

> By activating a dormant software lock on their newest iPhones, Apple is effectively announcing a drastic new policy: only Apple batteries can go in iPhones, and only they can install them. I really dislike the phrasing attached to this story. It's not a lock: a third party installed battery still works , the phone isn't refusing to start up until you go to an Apple Store and have an authentic Apple(tm) battery inst…

Except where the error is still displayed even when you transfer in an apple original battery from another phone.

As per the iFixit report, the Apple chip that identifies it as an 'Apple Battery' can be moved to another battery from any/dubious source. Given this, how can software KNOW that it's truly an Apple original battery.

Therefore, Apple is only 'vouching' for the battery health of batteries replaced via a confirmed 'chain-of-custody'.

Could the message allow the health to be shown anyway? Sure... but it's not like a message pops up every time you wake your phone.

Re: Rotten Apple: Right to Repair Roundup

#120

Post by nfellaby »

tomxor wrote: post #106

This is such a bad article, I half suspect it's astroturfing and food intended for Apple apologists. It's focused on a single small part of the problem and unnecessarily misrepresented it. As a reminder of the broader picture: Apple has a strong anti-repair stance, they have lobbied for this [1], have engaged in broad, deceptive strategies to remove 3rd party repair options, by confiscating legally refurbished hardwa…

This is the real issue.

Personally, I've replaced many components on iPhones through the ages. Often the replacement parts I've ordered have been sub-standard and that was the risk I've accepted as I was purchasing from unknown sellers. Sometimes the parts have been on par with the original components and I've been very pleased with my purchase.

The right to repair should be protected. When I am no longer able to fix my own purchases then I no longer feel I own the device.

This is especially true given Apple present themselves as an environmentally conscious brand. Often people don't have the opportunity to get parts replaced by Apple directly, or they don't have the means. Ensuring there are options for everyone promotes reuse and recycling. Additionally it limits the extent that a given company can build in planned obsolescence.

However. My opinion is that in purchasing a second hand device I want to know which components are from the OEM. This is especially important for components that are not easily validated, i.e. the battery. I can then take the risk of price vs quality at face value.

I get the impression here that people are very vocal about one side or the other, but I feel there is a balance to be made.

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