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HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

jeromecohen.net

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Re: HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

#111

Post by atjd »

tepidandroid wrote: post #88
suff wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody is bowing to your tyrannical world view. It stops here.

This is kind of a childish comment. What authority do you have to stop someone from freely expressing their opinion?

Actually, the fake news these days make me re-think the concept of `free speech`.

Firstly, More free speech sometimes means more fake news. Creating and spreading false or biased news are so easy, as the society goes, the problem we deal become more and more complicate, if we cannot get the right info and we do not possess the right mind how come expect us to make a ration decision, we all know what happened to Galileo, can anyone say what they did to Galileo is undemocratic.

Secondly, the common crowd are not that care about the truth, i discussed with a few people lives in HK through the internet, they actually do not know anything about the extradition law, and they still went to the protest. This is why I do not believe in any form of direct democracy.

Re: HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

#112

Post by suff »

Bakary wrote: post #87
suff wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody is bowing to your tyrannical world view. It stops here.

I'm not exactly sure what your comment is even supposed to mean, but I'll bite. Maybe my predictions will turn out to be dead wrong, but as it stands it's unlikely that anyone is willing or prepared to stop what China is doing, and it's unlikely that Hong Kong is going to last very long because they have less and less power as time goes by. I personally am a lot more sympathetic to HK's struggle, and I encourage peop…

There is too much at stake to stand back and be a pessimist. If our response to it affects the outcome in any way, then for the good of everyone we need to resist with all our might, not give in to appeasement. There were many in the UK who wanted peace treaties with Germany in WW2 etc. There will always be an impulse to step back and do nothing, but they were on the wrong side of history.

Re: HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

#113

Post by suff »

atjd wrote: post #111
tepidandroid wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is kind of a childish comment. What authority do you have to stop someone from freely expressing their opinion?

Actually, the fake news these days make me re-think the concept of `free speech`. Firstly, More free speech sometimes means more fake news. Creating and spreading false or biased news are so easy, as the society goes, the problem we deal become more and more complicate, if we cannot get the right info and we do not possess the right mind how come expect us to make a ration decision, we all know what happened to Galil…

... says the paid troll sitting in China...

Re: HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

#114

Post by tepidandroid »

suff wrote: post #113
atjd wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, the fake news these days make me re-think the concept of `free speech`. Firstly, More free speech sometimes means more fake news. Creating and spreading false or biased news are so easy, as the society goes, the problem we deal become more and more complicate, if we cannot get the right info and we do not possess the right mind how come expect us to make a ration decision, we all know what happened to Galil…

... says the paid troll sitting in China...

This is actually against comment guidelines:

"Please don't make insinuations about astroturfing. It degrades discussion and is usually mistaken. If you're worried, email us and we'll look at the data."

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

#115

Post by gamblor956 »

codedokode wrote: post #103
gamblor956 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The guys in Gitmo were captured on the battlefield so the alternative is that they could be dead. But let's focus on the lack of process in taking them captive instead of just killing then.

There are international treaties about handling prisoners of war. The thing is that US found a loophole not to admit that they are prisoners of war. What US did is similar to what their enemies like Taliban do.

The US didn't "find a loophole." Prisoner of war protections under international treaties only apply to state participants, meaning members of a state army.

Terrorists and other non-sanctioned armed forces are not protected by treaties between states because they are not fighting on behalf of a state. This is a recognized and intended exception to the rules governing POWs.

Re: HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

#116

Post by dang »

suff wrote: post #82
Bakary wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These help a lot to be sure, but the city has gone from having an economy that was almost a third of the mainland's in 1993, to a fifth at the handover, to less than 3% today.[0] It is still important but no longer crucial to China. In a generation or so, it will be just another city among dozens. The idea that rights and liberties are absolutely essential is a nice bedtime story we can tell ourselves, but if there w…

Nobody is bowing to your tyrannical world view. It stops here.

We've banned this account for repeatedly violating the site guidelines.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

#117

Post by Bakary »

duxup wrote: post #15
throwaway2048 wrote: post #7

For all the vaunted talk about how the CCP plans in terms of centuries and how they are so much more far sighted than western politicians, the continual abuse of Hong Kong's special status seems extremely short sighted, because it is going to make peaceful re-unification of Taiwan completely impossible.

There might be two things at play, the first described in the article that this is really a ploy to get "countries that have extradition treaties with Hong Kong to either renegotiate them successfully " possibly in favour of China. Also Hong Kong's status might just be a constant question that if Hong Kong is part of China but has some local autonomy....why can't other parts of China? Especially if there was an econo…

These already exist, there are 5 autonomous regions based around minority groups. There's also Macau which has a similar status to Hong Kong even if the system is quite different.

Re: HK's extradition law: Not just HK people have reason to fear Chinese “justice”

#118

Post by Bakary »

codedokode wrote: post #101
Bakary wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These help a lot to be sure, but the city has gone from having an economy that was almost a third of the mainland's in 1993, to a fifth at the handover, to less than 3% today.[0] It is still important but no longer crucial to China. In a generation or so, it will be just another city among dozens. The idea that rights and liberties are absolutely essential is a nice bedtime story we can tell ourselves, but if there w…

Well, China of course can make Hong Kong "a city among dozens" if it tries hard, but today a citizen of Hong Kong has an average income of $46 000, while a Chinese citizen only $8 960 [1]. For comparison, in Korea an average income is $28 000 and in Japan it is $38 000. But I agree that Chinese government definitely is able to lower the income of the citizens to Chinese average within 20 years. > The idea that rights…

Despite all of these absurd constraints on business, companies are bending over backwards to establish themselves in China, because the market is that huge and profitable.

All of these points are great, but HK became wealthy as an intermediary between Asia and the West. Now it is losing what remains of that role. They will lose their high salaries not primarily because of the mainland's interference (although I'm sure it'll be huge factor) but for the same reason that wages are stagnating or dropping in the West. As time goes by there are fewer and fewer clear reasons why the average HKer will be worth a higher salary than so many other nations.

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