"infinite avalanche" is a commonplace, boring phrase? Wonder where he's from.
Sounds like he's super white.
Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
111–120 of 173 posts
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#112Earlier quoted context omitted.
Because of the way subconscious prejudice works, unless you put a finger on the scale in the other direction then all the white guys are hired (in part) because of their appearance.
Well, Asians are getting hired at ~3x the rate of Whites in Bay area tech firms. So it can't just be benefitting Whites. In fact, at many Bay area companies Whites are a minority. Not that I'm trying to grind an axe here, but it is pretty much counterfactual to say that explicitly meritocratic hiring benefits Whites above all others. For what it's worth I think this question about hiring practices is welded to the th…
>> Asians are getting hired at ~3x the rate of Whites in Bay area tech firms.
This is one of the shallowest and ill-informed comments I've seen. Asians are getting hired at ~3x the rate of Whites in Bay area tech firms to the extent that Hispanics are getting hired at ~3x the rate in restaurant kitchens and janitorial roles.
Minorities usually get hired into jobs Whites dont want. Often these are ugly jobs handling batch duty, production support, touch engineering timelines, and the like. Ask an Asian if they wouldnt rather be sitting in the boardroom or golf course putting together strategy decks or vaguely talking about where to invest "innovation funds" or other wishy washy activities.
Along the same lines, Hispanics are over represented in line kitchen, janitorial staffs, hotel cleaning crews, etc NOT because whites dont want those jobs but because whites refuse to take those jobs.
Ask any Asian or Hispanic or person of African descent if they wouldn't rather be at the VC fund making decisions on which Asians will be getting VC funds and working on ramen noodles for the next three years. We just dont usually get those opportunities.
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#113Earlier quoted context omitted.
Subconscious bias means your concern is applicable regardless of your skin color or gender. If you’re a white male, you could easily have been hired simply because of your skin color and gender and not your abilities. Effectively, your point is moot. Maybe worry less about the thoughts and feelings of who hired you and focus on doing your best work.
>If you’re a white male, you could easily have been hired simply because of your skin color and gender and not your abilities. This may have been the case decade(s) ago, but I think the climate is very different now. With the prevalence of social "justice" hiring policies, I'd be much more confident I was hired because of ability, rather than to fill a quota, as a white male than any other race/sex combination. Sadly…
> This may have been the case decade(s) ago, but I think the climate is very different now.
I don't. I've met many incompetent white males in over their heads.
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#114Earlier quoted context omitted.
This comment reminds me somewhat of the Oxford and Cambridge interviewing processes. They have names and educational backgrounds to hand, and it's well known that all things being equal, tutors would always rather go for a kid from a state echool / underprivileged / non traditional background over one that went to a top public school. It's not just a matter of hitting targets - the alternative is that everyone who ge…
It's a double edged sword. In tech, it's been found that blind hiring processes where candidates' name, education, and past employers are obscured (a third party broadly describes the education and work experience but doesn't give any explicit names) does result in more hires from less prestigious universities and companies. But it does make the hired population more male and more white & Asian. I think triplebyte di…
>> But it does make the hired population more male and more white & Asian
Is that a reflection of bias or a reflection of the graduate hiring pool? If 90% of the CS graduates are male and your hiring process hires 90% male, is that bais or simply an extension of some problem upstream?
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#115Earlier quoted context omitted.
This comment reminds me somewhat of the Oxford and Cambridge interviewing processes. They have names and educational backgrounds to hand, and it's well known that all things being equal, tutors would always rather go for a kid from a state echool / underprivileged / non traditional background over one that went to a top public school. It's not just a matter of hitting targets - the alternative is that everyone who ge…
It's a double edged sword. In tech, it's been found that blind hiring processes where candidates' name, education, and past employers are obscured (a third party broadly describes the education and work experience but doesn't give any explicit names) does result in more hires from less prestigious universities and companies. But it does make the hired population more male and more white & Asian. I think triplebyte di…
How is that in any way double edged? Or am I wrong in thinking that hiring policies should strive to be as meritocratic as possible, even if that means more white/Asian men?
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#116The obsession with biases is a form of bias, you not only have to check what fake name you are submitting, you must make sure the people reading it are the same, that the mood of the people reading its the same and that their way of thinking hasn't changed much; such psychological uncertainties are the same reason psychology experiments are hard to replicate. Not to mention the randomness of things like if your resum…
I'm certainly stereotyping and assuming (and we know what they say about assuming) But I'd be willing to put money down you're in the demographic who tends not to fall victim to negative biases. I'll put $50 on that.
Unfortunately there is no clear answer to that, I'm latino but living and working in a south american country so its irrelevant; but I have searched for jobs overseas (remote) and a few times I have landed the job.
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#117Earlier quoted context omitted.
>If you’re a white male, you could easily have been hired simply because of your skin color and gender and not your abilities. This may have been the case decade(s) ago, but I think the climate is very different now. With the prevalence of social "justice" hiring policies, I'd be much more confident I was hired because of ability, rather than to fill a quota, as a white male than any other race/sex combination. Sadly…
> This may have been the case decade(s) ago, but I think the climate is very different now. I don't. I've met many incompetent white males in over their heads.
I’ve met many incompetent people who don’t belong at their job. Race and gender isn’t related.
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#118Earlier quoted context omitted.
>If you’re a white male, you could easily have been hired simply because of your skin color and gender and not your abilities. This may have been the case decade(s) ago, but I think the climate is very different now. With the prevalence of social "justice" hiring policies, I'd be much more confident I was hired because of ability, rather than to fill a quota, as a white male than any other race/sex combination. Sadly…
> This may have been the case decade(s) ago, but I think the climate is very different now. I don't. I've met many incompetent white males in over their heads.
That's the Peter Principle, and it applies to everyone.
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#119Earlier quoted context omitted.
At first I felt the same way because I may be a beneficiary of these types of policies. Who likes being a charity case? But then I realized that this is just work, and I don't really care. If it gets me closer to a comfortable retirement more quickly, so be it. Ends, means, etc. Edit: I'm speaking about opportunities in general. The selection policy described by GP would put me at a disadvantage because I have a comp…
I'm Hispanic and have resigned myself to this as well. While I may benefit from getting a job, I'm still subjected to what I would consider racism which I have to publicly turn a blind eye to. I'll give an example: "Latinx" is not a thing. Yet, I need to listen to a lot of white and other non-hispanic people say it all of the time. It feels like someone just reached into our culture, ripped out its core identity and…
I grew up in a majority hispanic community, but I'm not hispanic. I find it very hard to say "latinx" because that's not the label used when I was growing up. However, "hispanic" is apparently exclusive and should be avoided. I've asked my hispanic friends what they think about "latinx". They all hate it and never use it themselves. One said of the recent PC wave: "This is all perpetrated by clueless people, almost all white, who tell us what problems we suffer from and how we should solve them." I fall into the LGBT bucket and that's a different minefield, but I can sympathize.
I got off topic. Nonetheless I agree that if I were to constructively criticize these often misimplemented diversity initiatives, it wouldn't be well received. Meanwhile I'll let the compound interest do its thing.
Re: Can fake names create bias in interviewing?
#120Earlier quoted context omitted.
>If you’re a white male, you could easily have been hired simply because of your skin color and gender and not your abilities. This may have been the case decade(s) ago, but I think the climate is very different now. With the prevalence of social "justice" hiring policies, I'd be much more confident I was hired because of ability, rather than to fill a quota, as a white male than any other race/sex combination. Sadly…
> This may have been the case decade(s) ago, but I think the climate is very different now. I don't. I've met many incompetent white males in over their heads.
There are tons of people over their heads, everywhere, of all races and sexes.
But as the other person who replied to you noted, people now are openly stating that they want to avoid hiring white males.
>Sadly I've had to bring up my genetic background recently as a pure survival mechanism because people keep telling me to my face that they don't want to hire white men so I need to let them know I'm not white so I don't get instantly filtered out.
In recent times, I have not heard that more frequently about any other race/sex combination. To me it's undeniable that the hiring climate has changed drastically.