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Six Months at Riot Games

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Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#111

Post by zbentley »

shard972 wrote: post #23
irb wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If use of racist and homophobic slurs is 'gaming culture' then there is problem with gaming culture. I don't really see how that kind of language is something that needs protecting.

I think there is something wrong with a culture that feels the need to supress what is effectively amateur comedy going on within small groups. Targeted harassment sure, that's not something to just blindly protect but as a homosexual, i see more harm in trying to police jimmy calling his friends faggots playing CoD than I see in allowing people to speak their minds. Until someone can posit a great explanation for wh…

It stops being "amateur comedy" when it starts directly interfering with other people against their will.

If I go to a comedy show, I accept that I might get offended; that's on me. The power dynamic when I go to work, where I am expected to work with my team in order to get compensated, is massively different.

Nobody is making claims about "policing" (whatever that means in context). I don't care about words impact on "society as a whole" as some abstract concept. Society as a whole is comprised of people, and starts with the people around you upon whom you have the most direct impact. If you knew you worked with (or played a game of CoD with) a gay person, or a black person, how would you feel about using those words? That's why it's "bad for society as a whole"--because it's bad for the people right next to you.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#112

Post by detaro »

zimablue wrote: post #105
glassesman wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I saw men acting the way men do in a very male environment and objectifying/trying to sleep with women. I'm a man and I do none of this, even in a "very male environment."

Well that's fair enough but in some cultures it's fairly common. I am not a big bro guy but I've definitely discussed women with male friends/colleagues. I don't think it's super demeaning or immoral to discuss girls that you like, it's just getting very taboo in parts of Western culture when done by men. Sex dynamics are like at the core of society it's all still happening whether you're speed to discuss it or not.

There's also a difference between "talking about women" and the things described in the article (and a lot of different ways of talking about women, which can be done without degrading language). Calling a coworker a "Ho" or complaining they'd not be willing to share a hotel room with an unknown man is not the same level as "they didn't like that we talk about women".

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#114

Post by Uberphallus »

pmyteh wrote: post #76
Uberphallus wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you. And the fact that this was posted on Tumblr including a Content Warning only adds icing to this ironic cake. To those who disagree, lemme put it this way: it's not only videogame culture, it is plain old trash talk. Boxing, basketball, soccer, UFC, tennis, you name it, you have it in most competitive sports. It shocks pretty much anyone who hasn't taken part in a competitive sport/e-sport community…

It's absolutely LGBT-phobic. Do you know how many out gay professional footballers there are in the UK? Zero. Because the atmosphere around sexuality in professional football is sufficiently toxic that very few people are willing to come out before they retire. These things can change. Thirty years ago black players had bananas thrown at them on the pitch. After a lot of work, racism is now rare at football grounds,…

Justin Fashanu [0] is a counter example. He came out in 1991(!). I don't see how it's a problem now when it wasn't back then. That said, it's the fandom that's rotten, not the players and the industry itself.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Fashanu

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#115

Post by detaro »

zimablue wrote: post #56

Looking at this skeptically, given that as she says she put a target on her own back there's not much concrete here about problems she personally faced. Companies have a culture, it might not be your culture, and it's mental to expect to be able to walk in and attack it in the first six months then everything be sweetness and joy. Joining a gaming company and complaining about female outfits is roughly equivalent to…

And if in that women-dominated environment they targeted you with degrading comments or sexual harassment that would be just as bad, what's that comparison supposed to tell us? (and doing the same to men in a male-oriented environment isn't ok either if they aren't ok with it)

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#117

Post by Djvacto »

almostCEO wrote: post #110
Djvacto wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please pm me what company you are almost CEO of. I want to be adequately prepared to avoid this place like the plague. Also, I'd like to point out, you said: >(some people even go and insult like you, because they can’t handle people having different opinions). >stories like this encourages me to never hire women, because they’re obviously over-sensitive and will at some point write a “I have been offended and this c…

What’s the relationship exactly? I’m not saying to not hire women because they think differently, but because they’re much more likely to react in a harmful way against a company with these types of posts. That has nothing to do with me presenting this fact and another user calling me “asshole” for expressing an opinion.

It seems to me that you're allowed to have whatever opinions you want. But if your opinions make you an asshole, people are gonna call you out on it.

Also have you ever considered that you think women are more likely to react in a harmful way because you're incapable of looking at something like this with empathy for women, because you're incapable of understanding their point of view? Dig deep, and try to look at this from the perspective of another human being. Start from scratch, forget your preconceived notions and look at this from a new angle.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#118

Post by ethbro »

shawn wrote: post #87
TillE wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seriously can't think of a single idea for how to ban toxic players at scale? Start with crowd-sourcing via reports, then pass it over to customer service once a critical mass has been achieved. Make sure one person can't easily create a new account after being banned. This really isn't a new problem, tons of companies of all sizes have tackled it with varying success.

Spoken like someone who’s never played the game. Get ready to be banned for no fault of your own, just because your three teammates decided to report you for the lulz. There are people who post on /r/dota2 complaining that they get banned from the game for nothing but picking techies each game. They don’t even say anything. People just report them immediately. By the way, streamers are one of the most high impact use…

Just because there are false positives or one company has a bad implementation doesn't make it an unsolveable problem.

As parent mentioned, ml sentiment analysis + logging + peer reporting + final human analysis = problem effectively combated

It's the final human analysis that companies are loathe to fund (e.g. Facebook), as costs scale with user count.

But it's not efficiently unsolveable with current tech. Therefore, companies simply aren't prioritizing it. And won't, as long as the impact of toxic users isn't impacting the bottom line.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#119

Post by shawn »

lubonay wrote: post #96
shawn wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? The CEO does not speak for me, especially when it comes to that.

Then again, you are not the company. If anybody speaks for the company as a whole, it's the CEO.

Sure, but bucketing a company as racist just because someone said the n word once in 2009 isn’t productive. It’s like calling pewdiepie racist.

Re: Six Months at Riot Games

#120

Post by pandasun »

The amount of white knights in this thread is absurd. She provided zero evidence and everyone is jumping to her rescue. Maybe wait for evidence first? Typical SF culture. Imagine if this was a guy accusing a woman. But that's different right?

Yeah yeah, downvotes incoming... I'll take it..

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