Earlier quoted context omitted.
Didn’t Hansen state that burning all coal and oil sand would do it? I‘m always wondering how much methane is assumed to be mixed in, as the amount of methane to be released is poorly understood as pointed out above.
Sorry, I should clarify: Hansen's paper indicated that burning all fossil fuels would create a 16 degree C warming, which would definitely be the end of the line for us, for reasons of heatstroke if nothing else, but in the same paper he does say that the temperature can't go up to Venus levels. So nature would eventually recover.
Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
111–120 of 124 posts
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#112Earlier quoted context omitted.
The vast majority of people I know (Texas) couldn't live a productive life without a car. Some people certainly could but not most. Meat, though, they could definitely do without—and for most of them it'd be healthier.
Strange, I'd heard it was refined carbs and sugar giving America diabetes and heart disease. Are you saying it's meat now?
The argument is probably that meat production emits higher levels of carbon than other types of food production.
Unrelated, meat does have an impact on diabetes and heart disease, so if you're concerned about those things, then you should definitely learn more about it.
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#113Earlier quoted context omitted.
There is a gigantic mountain of evidence in favor of climate change, and you're listening to industry propaganda produced by the very people who have a clear monetary interest in doing nothing! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_cooling#/media/File:Pee... https://www.skepticalscience.com/ice-age-predictions-in-1970...
"Oceanic thermocline" never fails to trigger people. As soon as they actually do in fact research it, they realize that: a) we don't have the data b) we don't have an accurate/sane mathematical model for it. We can't use satellites to measure anything other than surface temperature of the ocean; it would require an actual, physically located sensor network spread throughout the oceans of the world to get this informa…
...and atmospheric temperature, and surface temperature of the land, and the solar energy arriving on Earth, and the energy being radiated away from Earth. There are plenty of things we can measure to show that there is warming beside just deep ocean temperature. We probably need deep ocean temperature measurements to predict accurately how the warming effects will be distributed, but we don't need it to show the warming is happening.
I don't know what you are going on with about the oceanic thermocline because all you've said is that there is some problem with some data related to some phenomenon involving it and that we don't have enough data to understand the oceanic thermocline.
You seem to think this thermocline problem is inconsistent with global warming. Let's say you are right. So what? You noted that we don't have good data or models for the thermocline.
We do have good data and models on dozens of things that do indicate warming. Generally in science when you have a lot of things that have good data and good models and support a theory, and some thing without good data or a good model that doesn't fit the theory, you wait until you get good data on the later before considering throwing out the theory.
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#114Earlier quoted context omitted.
> there is a wider range of values to ascribe to changes in temperature from 60F-100F or approx 16-38C And why is that important? Are our bodies so finely tuned that it's important to know the difference between 104 and 105 F? Even in the less granular celsius, unless it's just about bragging rights everything is about brackets anyway. 30+: wear shorts and hydrate 20-30: comfortable in short sleeves 10-20: bring a li…
Am I missing something, or are we just adapted for very different climates? Freezing is "wear a sweater" to you? I don't own a winter coat, but if I did it would come out of the closet somewhere in the 5-10C range.
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#115Earlier quoted context omitted.
This will happen. It's actually already happening in developing countries. The disruption of food supplies has been causing annual riots all over the world. The US has remained insulated from these effects by virtue of being relatively rich and relying on over-priced, highly processed foods that have enough margin to buffer against price shocks. But this is clearly an untenable situation. Shit goes south really fast…
I actually think this huge block of gun owners in America share a particular mindset with each other that means they'll become the local arm of the government in the hinterland. Just as you always see affinity between police forces and right-wing activists, you'll see the government put on a face friendly to rural gun culture, and that group will be installed as enforcers. So I don't buy this argument that the wide a…
But I do foresee a situation where there's a clash between the well-fed police (who want to keep it that way) and the starving poor in the US. The inner city riots will not be an issue, most metro PDs have experienced and well equipped riot control departments.
It's the armed, rural uprisings that pose a threat. Think Cliven Bundy-types leading a group of protestors in sieges of government or office buildings.
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#116Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Oceanic thermocline" never fails to trigger people. As soon as they actually do in fact research it, they realize that: a) we don't have the data b) we don't have an accurate/sane mathematical model for it. We can't use satellites to measure anything other than surface temperature of the ocean; it would require an actual, physically located sensor network spread throughout the oceans of the world to get this informa…
> We can't use satellites to measure anything other than surface temperature of the ocean ...and atmospheric temperature, and surface temperature of the land, and the solar energy arriving on Earth, and the energy being radiated away from Earth. There are plenty of things we can measure to show that there is warming beside just deep ocean temperature. We probably need deep ocean temperature measurements to predict ac…
Water, especially a large deep mass of water like the Pacific, can hold a lot of heat energy.
And we don't know what is happening with the heat transfer and storage cycle; we don't even understand the full operation of heat exchange between ocean and the rest of the planet.
Thermocline is "about" 800 meters of water depth (that's a HUGE heat sink): https://oceanservice.noaa.gov/facts/thermocline.html
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#117Earlier quoted context omitted.
People blaming governments and corporations are merely using faceless scapegoats because the truth is too terrible to behold. Normal every day people don't really believe in climate change, don't really want to do anything and in fact don't have the dimmest clue as to what needs to be done, nor how to do that. I think dealing with the above fact is too much for people, so instead we simplify using familiar models and…
> Normal every day people don't really believe in climate change Polling data for the US shows that 64% believe that climate change is caused by humans and 60% believe we're already experiencing its effects. https://news.gallup.com/poll/231530/global-warming-concern-s... That's not the number many would like to see, but it's a clear majority, and we ought to be able to get stuff done with it. I think the problem is t…
I thought that is what news and reporters are suppose to do
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#118Earlier quoted context omitted.
You realize what the current development looks like on a chart right? https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
Thank you for this site the collection of data here is amazing!
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#119Earlier quoted context omitted.
First you yourself start talking about "the last decade", and now one or two centuries isn't long enough. You also say you think the last decade seemed colder, the reply you got was that 16 of the 17 hottest years since recording began were after 2000. But you ignore that part of the reply. You are working for the forces that want to stop our mitigation of the problem, you are the enemy.
Telling people "you are the enemy" certainly isn't going to win them over to your side.
It is no use to try to win them over, that's not why they're arguing.
Re: Earth at risk of becoming 'hothouse' if tipping point reached, report warns
#120Earlier quoted context omitted.
People know their personal largest impact is cars and meat. But personal convenience has always beaten doing the right thing.
The vast majority of people I know (Texas) couldn't live a productive life without a car. Some people certainly could but not most. Meat, though, they could definitely do without—and for most of them it'd be healthier.
Yes they can't live without a car, agreed. But this is by their own choosing.