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Chinese Government Fabricates Social Media Posts for Strategic Distraction

gking.harvard.edu

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Re: Chinese Government Fabricates Social Media Posts for Strategic Distraction

#111

Post by cirgue »

Aunche wrote: post #103
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very interesting. I always get that uncanny valley feeling even on Hacker News, especially when the comments concern China. This would explain a lot.

You get an uncanny valley feeling because the Western media always exaggerates the degree of how Orwellian or how much influence the Chinese government really has, so that they can get more clicks from people unfamiliar with China or who are mildly racist.

So I find this view really interesting because there is ultimately very little racism about dislike for the Chinese government. Most people’s misgivings have much more to do with the fact that a) no one wants to see fellow humans living in a distopia, and b) people look to China as an indication of where the world may be heading in the next few decades. Feeling apprehension about seeing an opaque, oligopolistic, and decidedly undemocratic system adopt a set of policies that are frankly unthinkable to people raised in the us or Europe is completely understandable. Using the term racism is interesting because this has much more to do with ideaologies and values than it does with race.

Re: Chinese Government Fabricates Social Media Posts for Strategic Distraction

#112

Post by fspeech »

DenisM wrote: post #93
qiqing wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

50c party is widely accepted as real a thing as Russian troll farms during the election, but I'd be skeptical if HN is a target. (I don't think you need an academic paper to 'prove' it's a real thing.) The reason you read defensive comments on HN (even from me) is due to how easily anti-China criticism slides from legitimate policy discussion into raw, tribal racism. I simply feel it is my duty to call out anti-Chine…

Could you please provide some example of hacker news comments you consider racist or otherwise worth fighting against?

How about right there the post he is responding to? Especially considering the context provided by the earlier post:

"... constant comments by Chinese studying in the US and burnishing their reps with the Party. You can almost always make Chinese English, an AI program could be trained to do it. "

Do you think following up that with

"Very interesting. I always get that uncanny valley feeling even on Hacker News, especially when the comments concern China. This would explain a lot."

has racism undertone or not? If you don't see things right in front of your eyes I don't know what else could convince you.

Add: Okay I see there are people who don't like what I said, so I will spell out more about my rationale. Firstly I didn't call out the earlier post other than using it as the context. I don't think that author could have known that the comments truly were from "Chinese studying in the US" and for "burnishing their reps with the Party", but in the context of discussing propaganda I accept that at least has plausibility. The follow-on post then points to HN, which concerns the posters here including myself. The exact meaning of the poster is somewhat ambiguous to me, however in light of the earlier comment I get the feeling that anyone who comments on China with a view and maybe language skill different from his is stereotyped both with race and motivation.

Re: Chinese Government Fabricates Social Media Posts for Strategic Distraction

#113

Post by aaron-lebo »

Aunche wrote: post #103
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very interesting. I always get that uncanny valley feeling even on Hacker News, especially when the comments concern China. This would explain a lot.

You get an uncanny valley feeling because the Western media always exaggerates the degree of how Orwellian or how much influence the Chinese government really has, so that they can get more clicks from people unfamiliar with China or who are mildly racist.

This is based on what?

Re: Chinese Government Fabricates Social Media Posts for Strategic Distraction

#114

Post by johnchristopher »

johnchristopher wrote: post #27

> Many academics, and most journalists and activists, claim that these so-called 50c party posts vociferously argue for the government’s side in political and policy debates. As we show, this is also true of most posts openly accused on social media of being 50c. I am not a native speaker. I can't parse that sentence :/. Why is this `also` true ? In addition to what ? Wouldn't it follow that posts arguing in favour o…

Thanks everyone :).

Re: Chinese Government Fabricates Social Media Posts for Strategic Distraction

#116

Post by jonathanyc »

Lionsion wrote: post #110
jonathanyc wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you like to respond to my points, or are you going to use the same tactic you did last time and completely ignore what others write in order to push your own agenda? Why is it that your account is only 67 days old and >75% of your comments are about China? Do you even comment on normal Hacker News topics that aren't related to politics?

> Would you like to respond to my points No. Please take your points to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17105121 . > in order to push your own agenda? My agenda is to stay at least vaguely on-topic. > Why is it that your account only 67 days old yet >75% of your comments are about China? Do you even comment on normal Hacker News topics that aren't related to politics? Because you didn't look past two days of com…

I invite others to repeat the experiment for themselves. At this point I am starting to wonder if the Chinese government is playing both the pro and anti-Chinese sides in order to make both seem equally ridiculous.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agent_provocateur

I am seriously tired of this weird and new trend but I will continue to fight against it when I can because HN used to be better than this.

EDIT: Just remembered the fact that Russian propagandists made both pro-Bernie and pro-Trump propaganda. Their goal was simply to divide Americans. I don't doubt that the Russians and the Chinese cooperate.

Also I find it quite telling that Lionsion still refuses to respond to any of my points.

Re: Chinese Government Fabricates Social Media Posts for Strategic Distraction

#117

Post by [deleted] »

fspeech wrote: post #112
DenisM wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you please provide some example of hacker news comments you consider racist or otherwise worth fighting against?

How about right there the post he is responding to? Especially considering the context provided by the earlier post: "... constant comments by Chinese studying in the US and burnishing their reps with the Party. You can almost always make Chinese English, an AI program could be trained to do it. " Do you think following up that with "Very interesting. I always get that uncanny valley feeling even on Hacker News, espe…

[deleted]

Re: Chinese Government Fabricates Social Media Posts for Strategic Distraction

#120

Post by Lionsion »

jonathanyc wrote: post #116
Lionsion wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Would you like to respond to my points No. Please take your points to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17105121 . > in order to push your own agenda? My agenda is to stay at least vaguely on-topic. > Why is it that your account only 67 days old yet >75% of your comments are about China? Do you even comment on normal Hacker News topics that aren't related to politics? Because you didn't look past two days of com…

I invite others to repeat the experiment for themselves. At this point I am starting to wonder if the Chinese government is playing both the pro and anti-Chinese sides in order to make both seem equally ridiculous. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agent_provocateur I am seriously tired of this weird and new trend but I will continue to fight against it when I can because HN used to be better than this. EDIT: Just rememb…

> Also I find it quite telling that Lionsion still refuses to respond to any of my points.

Ok, I'll bite. Here's my response:

You need to go outside and take a walk, because your "points" have been off topic, literally paranoid, and bizarrely personal. You're accusing me of being an "agent provocateur" and either a Chinese or Russian troll. That's crazy talk and utter nonsense.

Ignoring you isn't "telling," it's frustration and a lack of better options.

The truth is I'm a guy who was frustrated by a thread yesterday that was totally ruined by people who derailed it, perhaps like the 50 Cent Party would. Just to make it super clear: I don't think it was disrupted by the actual 50 Cent Party, but by people who maybe should consider learning to not act like it.

Edit: I apologize to everyone who reads this thread (or the dead comments below). In situations like this, the correct action is to ignore someone like my interlocutor, but that's difficult when he makes personal attacks. I should have held firm despite them.

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