I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life. • Hacker News Board

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#111

Post by mgkimsal » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:02 AM UTC

toomanybeersies wrote: post #68

saosebastiao wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know what you mean, but it’s only part of it. Plenty of restaurants fail despite excellent bookkeeping. Personally I’d posit that the ability to create, measure, and manage operational processes is far more important, because operations are where the (often invisible) opportunity costs wreak havoc on restaurants.

The fact that he managed to run out of money before he even opened shows that he had no idea of the cost involved in opening and running a restaurant. He then reinforces this by telling us that he was selling his food too cheap, so he was running at a loss. It seems like he actually did have his processes in order in the end, he got to a point where he was running a bit of a profit, and was on track, until he decided…

> until he decided to close for a week

And it was the week before 'the slow season'? They came back to the start of a slow period. It's almost comical how little thought/planning he managed to put in to things, and after getting a 4 star review, and things picking up, he decides to close things down "for a week"? Closing down during a known 'slow period' - that makes sense. I know seasonal/tourist places that do that. This was just... yet another misstep that, as you said, could easily have been avoided.

It became painful reading this. And it makes me think... this whole notion of '80% of restaurants fail' stuff is partially due to just really poor planning or non-critical thinking ability by people up front. Of course, more planning and analysis up front may just stop people from opening in the first place, which may bring the % rate of failures down, but the overall numbers would be lower too. It's hard not to read this and think "I'd be smarter than that - I wouldn't make those mistakes" (having worked in restaurants, I wouldn't make those mistakes - I'd likely make other ones!)

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#112

Post by averagewall » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:04 AM UTC

vlunkr wrote: post #59

dahart wrote: post #28

Having started a software business with too much optimism and too little business knowledge myself, and failed, I seriously have no idea how people start successful restaurants at all these days. No matter what mistakes he made, I feel for the guy, and the thousands of people every year trying to get a restaurant off the ground and ending up bankrupt. Aside from marketing, the initial costs of getting a SAAS business…

It's amazing to me how many reatauraunts come and go. Even in a small town you know there's one spot that has been through 5 restaurants in 5 years. It seems like an extremely risky business to start, I don't get how so many people are brave/foolish enough to try it. I certainly don't have the guts.

I think it's a bit like being an artist or athlete. The pool of people who enjoy it is enormous compared to the demand. I personally know many people who enjoy cooking, playing music, and playing sport but nobody who would pay those people for their work. It's everyone's hobby so the competition is fierce. The odds that you are better than everyone else in that huge rabble are slim.

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#113

Post by smelendez » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:07 AM UTC

dahart wrote: post #81

notl4wy3r wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd think that you'd work at a restaurant a little while before trying to start one. Learn the ropes a bit, etc. That has got to help with your chances of success.

While I agree deeply, it's kinda hard to get the right sort of experience without just jumping in. Owning and running a restaurant is very different from working at one, right? Same with software; I worked in software for a couple of decades before trying to start my own, and while it did help me with the writing software part, it didn't help me with the running the business and marketing and pitching parts. If anyth…

I get what you're saying, but I feel like he's more like trying to start a software business after writing a few SQL queries and Excel formulas.

How can you hire people or evaluate their work if you don't understand what they do?

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#114

Post by Frondo » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:07 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #84

ufmace wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know much about running a restaurant, but I figured he'd be in big trouble as soon as I read that number after reading the condition of the place. I've done remodelings, and I'm pretty sure that just remodeling that place alone would eat up the entire $60k. I have to figure that bootstrapping a new restaurant would run at least that much on its own, between laying in food, kitchen equipment, hiring staff, doi…

I'm surprised there isn't a big WeWork for restaurant start-ups. A large space converted into numerous kitchens, that can be rented for relatively inexpensively (no large upfront cost to buy equipment or the building, no large initial lease, etc). The WeKitchen owner would have its own inventory of kitchen equipment that could be rented and moved as needed, to facilitate a lot of various types of kitchen arrangements…

Interestingly enough, those do exist, sort of. I toyed, long long ago, with starting a food business, and looked into commercial kitchens you could rent for a few hours a week; they do exist!

They're a great service for people who can go in and cook up a batch of, say, baked goods that they then individually wrap and take to coffee shops, or whatever.

The guy in the story did just about everything wrong, though, in kind of an amazingly thorough fashion.

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#115

Post by moonka » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:10 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #84

ufmace wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know much about running a restaurant, but I figured he'd be in big trouble as soon as I read that number after reading the condition of the place. I've done remodelings, and I'm pretty sure that just remodeling that place alone would eat up the entire $60k. I have to figure that bootstrapping a new restaurant would run at least that much on its own, between laying in food, kitchen equipment, hiring staff, doi…

I'm surprised there isn't a big WeWork for restaurant start-ups. A large space converted into numerous kitchens, that can be rented for relatively inexpensively (no large upfront cost to buy equipment or the building, no large initial lease, etc). The WeKitchen owner would have its own inventory of kitchen equipment that could be rented and moved as needed, to facilitate a lot of various types of kitchen arrangements…

There are commissary style kitchens around. I know a pizza place in Seattle that started up by making pizzas out one, and allowing people to pick up in the alley across the parking lot.

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#116

Post by mgkimsal » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:13 AM UTC

bduerst wrote: post #25

binarymax wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An order of magnitude higher than 60k, if your goal is to compete in the market he was targeting. For 60k he could have opened a pizza or sandwich shop.

You'd have a hard time even opening a Subway with $60k

I googled subway franchise, found http://www.franchisedirect.com/directory/subway/ufoc/915/

Low end estimate is $150k required up front, and high end of $320k. However, in that low end - $85k estimate for leasehold improvements. $15k for initial subway franchise fee.

Local sandwich shop opened up a few years back and... while I don't know all the numbers, he didn't put in $200k up front. I suspect it may have been more like $40-$50k, between initial lease, equipment, stock, etc. Small town, passing traffic, little competition, he's done well enough that he's expanding - doubling his size and moving a bit up the street. He's also a very pragmatic guy, and the sandwich biz has been in his family for a couple generations, so I have to think they're at least moderately profitable.

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#117

Post by Cd00d » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:15 AM UTC

mattnewport wrote: post #26

photoJ wrote: post #4

Running a restaurant is hard and unsurprisingly its even harder if you never have run one before. Staffing, food cost, vender management and health code malarky: these are some of the first things that make or break a restaurant. Then maybe location. Quality of food clearly doesn't make the list, at least not disconnected from price as Dominos, McDonalds and Starbucks succeed with high probability. Sad to see a vanit…

A point that Gordon Ramsay makes is that consistency is more important than peak food quality for a restaurant. Occasionally serving bad food does way more harm than occasionally serving amazing food does good since many customers will not return after one bad experience and you won't establish regulars if your quality is not consistent. What McDonalds and Starbucks do well is produce consistent (though not particula…

I'm taking (off topic) issue with the notion that Starbucks is not particularly high quality. Before Starbucks the options for coffee were almost universally limited to weak or burnt and stale bland Columbian beans. Starbucks is excellent at consistency (that was in the manual actually; I worked as a Starbucks barista for a year after college), to the extent that they replaced their skilled/training-required espresso machines with push button devices, but that does not diminish the overall more-than-acceptable quality.

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#118

Post by jamestimmins » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:16 AM UTC

smelendez wrote: post #109

jamestimmins wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're almost describing a high end twist on a mall food court. It's an interesting idea. I suspect this doesn't exist because the high startup costs (multiple full kitchen build outs would like push costs into the 7-8 figure range) would be too high given the inconsistency of restaurant rents. With office rents working on fairly regular timelines, it's easier to get a new tenant before an old one has finished up. Bu…

Is this not the food halls popping up in a lot of cities?

Do you mean like the Ferry Building in SF? If so, then I guess so! Although that may not be specifically what OP was picturing. May have been picturing something where each restaurant had their own dining area.

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#119

Post by mgkimsal » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:21 AM UTC

paulie_a wrote: post #61

AmVess wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gordon Ramsay is one of the most experienced and successful restaurateurs ever, and has had numerous failures along the way. Before he became TV famous, he worked in his restaurant every day until 1 AM, and back to it 6 hours later...every day, for many years. People vastly underestimate the time and dedication needed to run a restaurant. If you aren't built for it like Ramsay, you will regret it. For a lot of owners…

I always thought Gordon Ramsey was a douchebag from a cursory glance. But after watching his shows and reading his books, he is pretty awesome. I think he is justified in being annoyed by amateurs asking for help then arguing/ignoring his advice.

> I think he is justified in being annoyed by amateurs asking for help then arguing/ignoring his advice.

Anyone who is an expert in their field should feel justified in being annoyed by people asking for help then ignoring or arguing with said help. Happens to me on a regular-enough basis that I can usually predict how a request for help is going to turn out. Not alway, but often enough.

Re: I poured my blood, sweat and life savings into my restaurant. It ruined my life.

#120

Post by siliconc0w » Thu, Nov 09, 2017, 5:22 AM UTC

I like to visit local neighborhood restaurants to give these places hope because I hate seeing another retail location taken up by a franchise or worse of all - banks which are just basically dead space. To digress - they just opened another WF near me so there are now five total. Each is essentially a huge empty building with a huge empty parking lot. It's like the city decided they didn't want any useful commerce happening in this area and zoned it entirely for banks. Sad.

Meanwhile within walking distance there are like two restaurants and a coffee shop and I count myself lucky I even have that and visit all of them at frequently because I so treasure them. Even if their food isn't that amazing they at least somewhat contribute to the community of their surroundings.