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The Depression Thing

zachholman.com

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Re: The Depression Thing

#111

Post by scythe »

Omnius wrote: post #75
gblain23 wrote: post #11

Cutting gluten out of my life basically "cured" my depression, which sounds crazy, since it is just something I'm eating... I'm not allergic, but probably intolerant. I ate wheat for most of my life. I'm pretty sure it is related to inflammation, and how eating wheat products probably screwed my digestion up. I also rarely get sick anymore. Not trying to suggest that medicine, therapy, etc. does or does not work, jus…

1 hour hold account 1 hour old comment. I am not trying to be negative but i have seen no science to state that cutting gluten is going to do anything at all for anyone unless they have Celiac disease. You want to back that up with study or something? Its just WOO if i am wrong i will be happy to eat some crow. Further more the comment near this one about some imaginary threshold of MEME count gives something legitim…

It's also impossible to know that you don't have celiac disease unless you've had an immunoassay that comes up negative. Not all celiac cases show severe GI symptoms. As such assuming that someone does not have celiac disease who has not been tested has a 1-2% false negative rate.

Secondly, gluten can aggravate FODMAPs sensitivity:

http://www.gastrojournal.org/article/S0016-5085(13)00702-6/f...

This study is often cited to "prove" that non-celiac gluten sensitivity does not exist, but what it actually shows is that most "NCGS" cases are caused by FODMAPs and that gluten can aggravate the symptoms in a person who has not cut out FODMAPs:

>In all participants, gastrointestinal symptoms consistently and significantly improved during reduced FODMAP intake, but significantly worsened to a similar degree when their diets included gluten or whey protein.

Gluten increases GI residence time in everybody, which is not an unhealthy effect on its own, but which can increase the duration of exposure to any dietary irritant:

http://www.gastrojournal.org/article/0016-5085(83)90374-8/pd...

>Hydrolyzed gluten prolonged intestinal transit time, and this effect was reversed by concomitant administration of naloxone

It's seriously that easy to just look up "gluten sensitivity" on Google Scholar or SciFinder or (insert academic search site here) to find these sort of studies. And frankly it's kind of annoying to see people who won't even go to that level of effort degrading the actual personal experiences of someone who is simply trying to improve their own life.

Re: The Depression Thing

#112

Post by thanatropism »

lqdc13 wrote: post #42

Please be advised that taking SSRIs can have negative side effects that you might not be aware of. When people I'm close with start taking them, they are less interested in being intimate and stop "loving"/being affectionate. In my experience, having a schedule, exercising and making sure you are around other people help a lot more while preserving your personality.

This, like a lot else in this thread, is good advice for people who are not depressed.

Have the blues? Cut the fast-digesting carbs and experience less blood sugar fluctuation.

Have bipolar depression that flips into florid mania after a day-long hike? Hoo boy.

Re: The Depression Thing

#113

Post by thanatropism »

ada1981 wrote: post #22
kyberias wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there legitimate other views of depression?

I believe depression often involves some developmental or shock traumas that prevent or inhibit the full feeling of emotions. The idea that depression is "anger directed inward" was a useful tool for me. The view that we can release these old traumas and form new pathways and responses helped me heal after a diagnosis of schizophrenia and bipolar (which included suicidal depression and panic attacks, anxiety).

Do you believe in Austrian economics or Young Earth Creationism too?

I mean, it's within your rights...

Re: The Depression Thing

#114

Post by pgeorgi »

jbob2000 wrote: post #102
DanBC wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But fuck it, that shit works for you -- you have no idea whether it'll work for anyone else. Since depression is a potentially fatal illness, and you appear not to have any training in psychiatry, psychology, psychotherapy, medicine, pharmacology, you should maybe recognise your limits. > Changing your lifestyle to treat depression works Only for some people. you have no idea how many people it does work for, and y…

The medical community calls what you're doing "terminal uniqueness" and I've noticed that this is very prevalent with people who suffer from depression: "Those therapies won't work on me, I am different, I need a special treatment". Sleep, eat well, keep active. Nothing about that advice is dangerous. But it is hard to do if you aren't in the habit of doing it. (I know what you're going to say next, "but chemicals in…

> Sleep, eat well, keep active. Nothing about that advice is dangerous

except if the response to "I tried, but it doesn't work for me" is "your depression makes it even harder, but that is literally irrelevant".

Your parent post didn't leave enough room for "try something else, but don't forget these once you're fit enough".

Re: The Depression Thing

#115

Post by Omnius »

scythe wrote: post #111
Omnius wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1 hour hold account 1 hour old comment. I am not trying to be negative but i have seen no science to state that cutting gluten is going to do anything at all for anyone unless they have Celiac disease. You want to back that up with study or something? Its just WOO if i am wrong i will be happy to eat some crow. Further more the comment near this one about some imaginary threshold of MEME count gives something legitim…

It's also impossible to know that you don't have celiac disease unless you've had an immunoassay that comes up negative. Not all celiac cases show severe GI symptoms. As such assuming that someone does not have celiac disease who has not been tested has a 1-2% false negative rate. Secondly, gluten can aggravate FODMAPs sensitivity: http://www.gastrojournal.org/article/S0016-5085(13)00702-6/f... This study is often ci…

Thank you for the links. As to laziness on searching for gluten sensitivity" i wasn't the one making the claim that it cures depression.

Have an upvote anyways for your efforts.

Re: The Depression Thing

#116

Post by johnny99 »

afpx wrote: post #85
ElatedOwl wrote: post #15

I was diagnosed with "major depression" when I was 14, did the medication and therapy thing for a bit but the medication made me a zombie. Therapy helped me learn to cope a little better, but I was never "cured" of my depression. My 20s have been pretty bad, but in the last year and a half I've lost 100+lbs and have been running and lifting. It turns out the common sense advice to depression was really what I needed…

I can only believe you when you say you cured yourself, but I just want to point out for others that this sometimes can be symptoms of hypomania (bipolar II). As an example, consider the following author’s self-cure for his bipolar II: https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelellsberg/2011/07/18/how-... Sounds pretty easy and awesome, right? Then, read his follow-up several years later: http://www.ellsberg.com/bipolar-ii-…

He said "seeing if I could go without" medication, which I think is different than saying he's cured.

But your point about bipolar II is really important. Taking anti-depressants (SSRIs) when bipolar can induce rapid cycling--a speeding up and intensifying of the depressed-elated cycle, which can be very dangerous, as I learned the hard way after being misdiagnosed. Bipolar II is often treatable (I'm deeply grateful that mine is), but with different approaches and medications than depression.

Re: The Depression Thing

#117

Post by holman »

gt_ wrote: post #87

Just some mellow "Brain Shock" side effects and he was on his way. Terrifying.

It’s extremely minor, and is a very common side effect. I’ll take these for a week or two over how I was feeling 100% of the time, every time.

Re: The Depression Thing

#118

Post by earlybike »

kbhn wrote: post #96
earlybike wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In fact, I would argue that rarely is depression caused by a clear reason which has a direct path to resolution. I'm gonna have to disagree pretty strongly with that assertion without any supporting evidence.

Sure, let me quote Harvard[1]: "It's often said that depression results from a chemical imbalance, but that figure of speech doesn't capture how complex the disease is. Research suggests that depression doesn't spring from simply having too much or too little of certain brain chemicals. Rather, there are many possible causes of depression, including faulty mood regulation by the brain, genetic vulnerability, stressfu…

‘It's believed’ != evidence

Re: The Depression Thing

#119

Post by ThrowawayP »

Swizec wrote: post #38
ElatedOwl wrote: post #15

I was diagnosed with "major depression" when I was 14, did the medication and therapy thing for a bit but the medication made me a zombie. Therapy helped me learn to cope a little better, but I was never "cured" of my depression. My 20s have been pretty bad, but in the last year and a half I've lost 100+lbs and have been running and lifting. It turns out the common sense advice to depression was really what I needed…

Yup same here. Clinical depression in high school, meds, therapy, suicide watch the whole shebang. Fun times, can’t remember two years of my life. So far the only thing that’s actually worked has been staying busy/productive/creative, good nutrition, exercise etc. Everyone always tells me I’m an insensitive dick when i suggest getting off their ass and doing stuff to treat their depression. But fuck it, that shit wor…

> Changing your lifestyle to treat depression works.

I did (and am still doing) all of those lifestyle changes and it didn't help me in the slightest. So much for that theory.

Not that people shouldn't try lifestyle changes but they are not the magic cure-all you're selling them as.

Re: The Depression Thing

#120

Post by rconti »

lqdc13 wrote: post #42

Please be advised that taking SSRIs can have negative side effects that you might not be aware of. When people I'm close with start taking them, they are less interested in being intimate and stop "loving"/being affectionate. In my experience, having a schedule, exercising and making sure you are around other people help a lot more while preserving your personality.

SSRIs never did a thing for me, but THOSE kinds of side effects were a drop in the ocean compared to the REAL problems going on in my head. If they had made a difference I'd have happily traded the side effects. Hell, the side effects were even worth it just to try something, ANYTHING.
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