Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense • Hacker News Board

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#111

Post by 0xbear » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:23 PM UTC

dreamfactored wrote: post #77

indubitable wrote: post #54

I find these allegations are deserving of some scrutiny. The entire story is quite bizarre when you begin to consider it. The NSA is apparently leaking like a broken pipe with this information. And it's peculiar because this is information that makes our intelligence agencies look completely inept. That is a very good thing if this story is fake, but a very bad thing if its true. It is stupefying that NSA contractors…

I'm going to take it that you've never done public sector contracting. The security rules are in reality less 007 and more school library, and this is totally believable. There is another story in the news now about soldiers smartphones being hacked in Eastern Europe. The troops are therefore made to go through water every day but some of them just put their phones in condoms. Defense contractors aren't even state em…

+1 having done this and having witnessed the staggering waste and incompetence on the part of people who should know better, I now feel really bad when paying my taxes. Truly, it’s better to not know how sausage is made.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#112

Post by bokglobule » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:33 PM UTC

mhneu wrote: post #66

mtgx wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's of their own doing: https://www.salon.com/2013/06/11/500000_contractors_can_acce... Also, I believe I read a recent article about them allowing even more private companies access to this stuff, but I can't find a link right now.

It's partially George Bush's doing - he put a rule into place saying the government had to hire more contractors. Fits with the GOP plans to weaken the govt to enable tax cuts for the wealthy, but the increasing use of contractors has been bad for security. Full time federal employees take a different oath and generally feel more loyalty to the agency.

Ah, maybe not. Watch the film "A Good American". It's out on Netflix.

People are people. Govt employees can have agendas that are bad for the rest of us just like contractors.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#113

Post by Larrikin » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:36 PM UTC

mythrwy wrote: post #78

0xfeba wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm so skeptical now of skeptical Russia posts. A 25 day old account who's first comment [0] was about media and divisiveness. 0 - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15336362

Maybe that's the first part of the evil plan? Make people see Russians everywhere. I try to look at content and don't care much who the poster might be. Because everyone has motive even if it's just boredom or attention.

When the number one tactic involves paying people to troll and influence on social media it's being willfully ignorant to look at every post in a vacuum and to not look for patterns.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#114

Post by notyourday » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:40 PM UTC

spaceseaman wrote: post #75

indubitable wrote: post #54

I find these allegations are deserving of some scrutiny. The entire story is quite bizarre when you begin to consider it. The NSA is apparently leaking like a broken pipe with this information. And it's peculiar because this is information that makes our intelligence agencies look completely inept. That is a very good thing if this story is fake, but a very bad thing if its true. It is stupefying that NSA contractors…

> Our media and our government lied to generate a case for war. And I feel lately that they are now trying to build a case for some sort of conflict, presumably cold, against Russia I mean, there's verifiable evidence Russia tried to influence our election. That's pretty new for a lot of Americans. I imagine that's why the government and the media are running wild with it. Mueller is still investigating. I would say…

> I mean, there's verifiable evidence Russia tried to influence our election. That's pretty new for a lot of Americans. I imagine that's why the government and the media are running wild with it. Mueller is still investigating. I would say to wait till that report comes out before jumping to conclusions.

I'm shocked, shocked, shocked there's gambling going on here! Shocked! We are the only ones who are supposed to be doing that!

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#115

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:46 PM UTC

indubitable wrote: post #100

dragonwriter wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Since Iraq I have become much more critical of pretty much everything. Our media and our government lied to generate a case for war. Uh, while there were some media collaborating with the government propaganda, the government's case for war was thoroughly and pretty completely debunked in the mainstream media, nearly in real-time. Few people paid as much attention to that as what the government was saying, which th…

There's a useful tool in search engines that I think are desperately underused. This [1] is a search for "Iraq" on Google with results from January 1st to March 1st, 2003. We would invade on March 20th. I'll leave the results without comment. I think they speak for themselves. A couple of asides are that it's very interesting to do the same sort of thing with "Russia" in more contemporary times. Our minds do very str…

[deleted]

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#116

Post by c3534l » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:47 PM UTC

dmix wrote: post #109

c3534l wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is this verifiable evidence so I can actually verify it?

It's only been ~1yr since the election. You have to be patient for big cases like this. Until then we have to trust the US intelligence community. Their messaging has been consistent that their arch-enemy they've been competing with for decades pulled a fast one on them and was unexpectedly effective at influencing an election. Government sources have been leaking a bunch of stuff to the press in the meantime. This w…

> You have to be patient for big cases like this

So in other words, no “verifiable“ proof at all, just rumors, hearsay, and unbacked assertions.

> Until then we have to trust the US intelligence community.

Sorry, no. Their success rate and overall trustworthiness is abysmal, let alone it's foolish to trust secret data even if it weren't the case.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#117

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:58 PM UTC

RandVal30142 wrote: post #97

indubitable wrote: post #54

I find these allegations are deserving of some scrutiny. The entire story is quite bizarre when you begin to consider it. The NSA is apparently leaking like a broken pipe with this information. And it's peculiar because this is information that makes our intelligence agencies look completely inept. That is a very good thing if this story is fake, but a very bad thing if its true. It is stupefying that NSA contractors…

>And I feel lately that they are now trying to build a case for some sort of conflict, presumably cold, against Russia. Russia invaded Ukraine & Crimea, ended up downing a civilian airliner killing them all. Slaughtered hospital workers in Syria after following victims of regime chemical weapons attack to the facilities. Has been funneling heavy weapons like T90 tanks into sub-state militias, including the designated…

[deleted]

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#118

Post by zghst » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:58 PM UTC

spaceseaman wrote: post #75

indubitable wrote: post #54

I find these allegations are deserving of some scrutiny. The entire story is quite bizarre when you begin to consider it. The NSA is apparently leaking like a broken pipe with this information. And it's peculiar because this is information that makes our intelligence agencies look completely inept. That is a very good thing if this story is fake, but a very bad thing if its true. It is stupefying that NSA contractors…

> Our media and our government lied to generate a case for war. And I feel lately that they are now trying to build a case for some sort of conflict, presumably cold, against Russia I mean, there's verifiable evidence Russia tried to influence our election. That's pretty new for a lot of Americans. I imagine that's why the government and the media are running wild with it. Mueller is still investigating. I would say…

We are witness to the return of menace and mischief by a motivated adversary, nonetheless they have always had their hand in US and EU politics.

The revisionist, election hacking narrative is a massive thoughtform, propped up by some savvy scoop every couple of weeks just to die down and go nowhere. Everything the media covers is tainted by an air of sentimentality and idealism, hardly great elements of good journalism, but it sells papers.

Those who think they really know men like Putin, those who believe they really know and understand evil, you will never know them. People who think they know live in a world of black and white, right and wrong, living within society but not operating in the raw layers of society where people make civilization a reality. Men like Putin, they live in this space, desperately trying to keep their reality/world alive. The way they do this is the same how we keep ours alive, they lie. Russians tell very good lies, they are very good at making whole new truths, but if you look very closely, it starts to come apart.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#119

Post by sergers » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 8:59 PM UTC

RandVal30142 wrote: post #97

indubitable wrote: post #54

I find these allegations are deserving of some scrutiny. The entire story is quite bizarre when you begin to consider it. The NSA is apparently leaking like a broken pipe with this information. And it's peculiar because this is information that makes our intelligence agencies look completely inept. That is a very good thing if this story is fake, but a very bad thing if its true. It is stupefying that NSA contractors…

>And I feel lately that they are now trying to build a case for some sort of conflict, presumably cold, against Russia. Russia invaded Ukraine & Crimea, ended up downing a civilian airliner killing them all. Slaughtered hospital workers in Syria after following victims of regime chemical weapons attack to the facilities. Has been funneling heavy weapons like T90 tanks into sub-state militias, including the designated…

Minus the taking of land, Crimea by Russia, and the civilian abduction (US just more secretive)same can be said for US actions over the past decades.

Does that mean USA is war with the world (under trump now, yes, but I am implying before that)?

How many other nations elections has USA undermined, accidental civilian casualties(including downing of a civilian plane) and funding to terrorists (directly funding Taliban and supporting terrorist groups.. not to forget Saudi Arabia)

As a non American, looking from the outside, it's hypocrisy that the US is offended someone else doing what they have been doing... Just Russia got caught and is being called out.

But I can understand the outrage, and in no way condoning Russia's actions... They have taken it to publicized extremes stoking aggressive behaviour to other nations and particularly the US

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#120

Post by cat199 » Thu, Oct 05, 2017, 9:01 PM UTC

codedokode wrote: post #84

dreamfactored wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to take it that you've never done public sector contracting. The security rules are in reality less 007 and more school library, and this is totally believable. There is another story in the news now about soldiers smartphones being hacked in Eastern Europe. The troops are therefore made to go through water every day but some of them just put their phones in condoms. Defense contractors aren't even state em…

Phones transmit signal so soldiers can be easily detected: if you see a large number of signal sources somewhere in the forest the probability is high that a military squad is hiding there. Soldiers should not have a phone when on duty. Futhermore, if military base is located near or in the city the enemy can bring an IMSI catcher and record phone identifiers, or intercept calls.

umm I think the point is that soldiers are sneaking phones in, and this is an example of bad security enforcement within the defense services, not that defense services shouldn't be heavily regulated internally..