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Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

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Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#111

Post by prodmerc »

hackuser wrote: post #105

Is the Indian government now also doing astroturfing? Does anyone know about any serious research or reporting on it? Chinese and Russian operations are well-known and reported, but I haven't heard of Indian ones. Seeing the same, generally weak talking points, angrily defending the Indian government, advocating nationalistic points of view, and repeated over and over - it all reminds me of threads critical of China…

I'm not defending anything, it's just extremely hypocritical to accuse India's system of being dystopian while currently existing systems in "developed" nations are even worse.

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#112

Post by realonedev »

splintercell wrote: post #95
realonedev wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Refer, https://thewire.in/24713/aadhaar-identification-simplified-m... The UIDAI has emphasised several times that information related to religion or caste is neither collected nor stored in the Aadhaar database. Applicants and holders are encouraged to look at their Aadhaar to confirm this

Give me a list of 1000 Indian names and I can guess their religion with nearly 95% accuracy. All the points you say sound like you're 'prepared' or 'rehearsed' to say things like this. When the next Gujarat riots happen, trust me just a list of people and their addresses would be sufficient enough to figure out where all the Muslims live.

>>I can guess their religion with nearly 95% accuracy.

95% of the stats are made on the spot, like you made above.

Your intuitions don't need to be true.

And, Godhra Train was burned by 2000 Muslims surrounding a train and burning people with nothing to escape.

Next time before mentioning Godhra and Muslims in same sentence don't forget to mention what 2000 Muslims did to unarmed people in train by locking the train compartment.

Prepared or reharshed :

Your intuitions don't matter nor does your opinion.

Unless you produce point by point convergant proof and data.

http://www.opindia.com/2017/05/the-real-whitewashing-how-the...

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#113

Post by ganduG »

realonedev wrote: post #70
ganduG wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice deflection! Are you disagreeing that voter lists were used in 2001 to discriminate against muslims? Do we have any laws preventing that from happening with aadhar data?

Do you even understand how Aadhar works? You made a claim. Can you prove that using an Aadhar number one can get the religion of a person?

Given a persons name you can guess with fairly reasonable accuracy what their religion is.

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#114

Post by eklavya »

devnonymous wrote: post #110
eklavya wrote: post #94

I am in the wait and watch camp. So far aadhar has shown promise and benefits. I am also in the "make it compulsory for income tax" group. For privacy, they will get their act together I hope (plug leakages if any). If they don't, it would be foolish for them to think that we won't come after them. I have faith in the current generation. The activation energy maybe high but boy do they protest when they do :)

> I am also in the "make it compulsory for income tax" group. I don't get this ! What exactly is this linkage solving ? Additionally everyone who advocates this disregards the fact that there are Non-resident Indians who are required to pay taxes but they are not entitled to an Aadhaar card and resident non-Indians who also need to pay taxes who are not required to get an Aadhaar card. Additionally, how exactly is th…

I think the Income Tax department can do the dedup themselves right? Seems easy, no different pan cards can have the same aadhar number?

Income tax records are protected by very strict laws already.

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#115

Post by [deleted] »

drieddust wrote: post #17
bpodgursky wrote: post #3

Seriously Mozilla? The Indian ID drive has ensured that benefits make it to the people who need them without 80% of it being skimmed by corrupt bureaucrats. Having a real identification gives very poor individuals the identification necessary to open bank accounts and interact with the financial sector. It's the first really reliable census data for a lot of areas. It's disgusting that Mozilla sits there and pontific…

> In 50 years, when a couple hundred million Indians aren't having trouble getting enough to eat because their government subsidies were stolen, then maybe it's worth having this conversation And how having bio-metric ID solves problem of stolen subsidies? Every time a subsidy is stolen, aaddhar card will shoot an arrow into corrupt bureaucrats. Our poor does not have access to Education and Law so they don't really…

[deleted]

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#116

Post by JumpCrisscross »

aub3bhat wrote: post #87
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fearmongering at a scale unseen before Such hyperbole weakens your argument. It's borderline zealous. I don't think you are a zealot and I think you have a valid argument, although I disagree with you. But expressing good thoughts in hyperbole is not effective here. (Another example is the "no right to criticise" argument. Nobody cares who has a legal right to do disagree. This isn't a court of law. All we care abo…

"fearmongering at a scale unseen before" is reasonable response when the argument uses words like "dystopian".

You have never seen anyone call anything dystopian before?

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#117

Post by JumpCrisscross »

realonedev wrote: post #106
splintercell wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Give me a list of 1000 Indian names and I can guess their religion with nearly 95% accuracy. All the points you say sound like you're 'prepared' or 'rehearsed' to say things like this. When the next Gujarat riots happen, trust me just a list of people and their addresses would be sufficient enough to figure out where all the Muslims live.

Can you read at all? Did you read through the link I had send you? It's not that hard. I will ask a simple question, can you detect the caste or religion of a person by knowing their Aadhar number?

> Can you read at all?...It's not that hard.

Please refrain from personal insults. We're trying to understand something together. Name calling doesn't promote that goal.

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#118

Post by realonedev »

blindwatchmaker wrote: post #98
realonedev wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disgusting comment. Please make sure you know what you are talking. Don't spread fake news like the Indian communists. Edit: If people want I compile produce point by point data to prove that Indian communists are masters at spreding fake news, for decades. I will even quote a website which is mostly anti current government (it spreads fake news most of the times) thewire.in/24713/aadhaar-identification-simplified-my…

> Don't spread fake news like the communists. > mostly anti current government (it spreads fake news most of the times) Do you consider views from sources that disagree with your own as 'fake news' ? A lot of what you've posted here sounds a lot like the hyper partisan BJP trolls that seem to pop up wherever there's any criticism of the Modi government. You should try to do better on HN, because I would prefer not to…

Your assumptions mean nothing,unless you produce quantifiable data and verifiable data source to proof any of your claims.

Your statement combining the words, hyper, troll, government, modi, sanity, are not backed up by any data nor they hold true for anyone else expect the ones having a biased brain such, as yours.

I can prove point by point how communists spread fake news.

Your assumptions about equating disagreeing with fake news with stamping as fake news, does not matter, it actually makes you a troll who just wants to spread the propaganda; that a person stating a media house as a fake news source necessarily disagrees with it, if he/she has an opinion at all about the fake news.

How in earth did you just assume that fake news = disagreement by the person who finds out the fake factor in the news.

A news is fake, means, it has not got verifiable data to back up it's headline or summary.

Simple and plain.

Why is it so hard for some people to understand?

I would rather communicate with those who don't label people and jump to conclusions.

Good day, and Remember,

Fake News = No verifiable data source + no quantifiable data.

Fake News Defender's arguments = oppose all those who find out the fake factor/fact check by abusing them and name calling them trolls "look he disagrees hence he calls it fake news".

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#119

Post by JumpCrisscross »

realonedev wrote: post #78
ganduG wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but the old lady in the village will have a problem with it when it is used to marginalize and discriminate against her. The riots in 1984 and in 2001 showed us how voter lists can, and will, be misused by people in power to their own benefit.

Disgusting comment. Please make sure you know what you are talking. Don't spread fake news like the Indian communists. Edit: If people want I compile produce point by point data to prove that Indian communists are masters at spreding fake news, for decades. I will even quote a website which is mostly anti current government (it spreads fake news most of the times) thewire.in/24713/aadhaar-identification-simplified-my…

> Disgusting comment...Don't spread fake news like the communists.

Your post would be stronger without this outburst at the top. Consider removing it? I think it will make others more receptive to your arguments.

Re: Aadhaar isn’t progress – it’s dystopian and dangerous

#120

Post by abhishivsaxena »

hackuser wrote: post #105

Is the Indian government now also doing astroturfing? Does anyone know about any serious research or reporting on it? Chinese and Russian operations are well-known and reported, but I haven't heard of Indian ones. Seeing the same, generally weak talking points, angrily defending the Indian government, advocating nationalistic points of view, and repeated over and over - it all reminds me of threads critical of China…

Aadhaar was supported by the previous government. This government continued it. Most of India is unwavered in their support, since they see the benefits of getting instant bank account or food subsidy. And not being forced to stand in a line for such simple stuff in 40C+ temperature and wasting your entire day.

There are more anti-aadhaar green accounts in this thread than pro-aadhaar. If your only argument is to bring thowaway statements like Nationalism/Russia etc into it, then it just reflects poorly on you.

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