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Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

varnull.adityamukerjee.net

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Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#111

Post by phkahler »

macspoofing wrote: post #63
phkahler wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He didn't refuse the scanner, he was given a choice and when his choice was going to get complicated he could no longer switch back to the scanner. He did opt for the scanner on his new flight. But none of that is really relevant to how he was treated. Why deny him a glass of water?

>He didn't refuse the scanner He wasn't detained because he refused a scanner. You know that. >when his choice was going to get complicated he could no longer switch back to the scanner. Well ... yeah. What you refer to as a complication was him testing positive for explosives or poison. >Why deny him a glass of water? Is that the problem? He didn't get a glass of water?

No, he wanted to switch back to the scanner when they escalated the pat down to something not decent to do in public.

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#112

Post by literallycancer »

dang wrote: post #102
Cpoll wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're the only consistent identity that I recognize, because you post this a lot :) I always have some concerns when I see it: - Obviously controversial (but not clearly trolling) posts like thr3290's can't be made without potentially endangering the poster (we've seen people fired for public or semi-public remarks e.g. "donglegate"). I feel that this would have a chilling effect on voices that go against th…

Oh of course, throwaways are legit when the topic is personally sensitive. Some of the best HN discussions happen that way; for example there was one the other day where a couple of throwaway accounts discussed what it's like to be non-criminal psychopaths. Obviously we'd never get that without throwaways. But that is easily distinguished from the users who routinely create throwaways in order to completely depersona…

>there was one the other day where a couple of throwaway accounts discussed what it's like to be non-criminal psychopaths

Do you mind linking it? I found something, but I'm not sure whether it was the one you meant.

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#113

Post by dang »

literallycancer wrote: post #112
dang wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh of course, throwaways are legit when the topic is personally sensitive. Some of the best HN discussions happen that way; for example there was one the other day where a couple of throwaway accounts discussed what it's like to be non-criminal psychopaths. Obviously we'd never get that without throwaways. But that is easily distinguished from the users who routinely create throwaways in order to completely depersona…

>there was one the other day where a couple of throwaway accounts discussed what it's like to be non-criminal psychopaths Do you mind linking it? I found something, but I'm not sure whether it was the one you meant.

In https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13848470, and specifically in these subthreads:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13848884

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13850914

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#114

Post by dang »

Cpoll wrote: post #107
dang wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh of course, throwaways are legit when the topic is personally sensitive. Some of the best HN discussions happen that way; for example there was one the other day where a couple of throwaway accounts discussed what it's like to be non-criminal psychopaths. Obviously we'd never get that without throwaways. But that is easily distinguished from the users who routinely create throwaways in order to completely depersona…

> On HN, commenters have a personal identity (which of course can be a pseudonym if you want). If some users want a site where there are no such identities, only free-floating comments with comment IDs, they should find or create such a site and participate there instead. There's room for lots of different kinds of internet forums. HN is just one kind, but it is that kind, and the reason we have moderation, including…

I don't want most of those posts to disappear either. The moderation comments you're referring to are more targeted than that.

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#115

Post by dang »

kefka wrote: post #109
macspoofing wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Say, are you referring to the Extremist Moslems, or Extremist Christians? I was referring to 9/11, obviously, because that resulted in our modern security state. >That whole innocent until proven guilty in a court of law... It doesn't count for non-Christians, does it? I'm not sure how 'innocent until proven guilty' applies here. Are you saying we don't need any airport security because that presumes guilt? >Both ha…

> I'm not sure how 'innocent until proven guilty' applies here. Are you saying we don't need any airport security because that presumes guilt? How about effective airport security, and not the facade of "security" we see. AKA: Oh looks a BROWN PERSON! And holding for someone for 6 hours without due process is a good thing? Yeah, no. Unless they're not a white christian. And that is the underlying message, going all t…

You've been crossing into incivility in this thread. That breaks the site guidelines, regardless of how wrong someone else is. Why? Because the wrong things going on in the world, wrong though they are, don't justify destroying this site. Treating other users like this leads to a downward spiral of retaliation that leads to destroying the site. If you're commenting here, it's your job to make sure that doesn't happen. So please post civilly and substantively, or not at all.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#116

Post by ajmurmann »

Pilfer wrote: post #99
jacquesm wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He set off the explosive detector, and didn't provide a good answer to why he set it off. What, short of "I was making a bomb" would be an answer that would satisfy you? It's not like it is up to him to know the intricacies of bomb detectors and their ridiculous false positive rates for certain chemicals, including such terribly dangerous goods as soap.

He doesn't know how to talk to security. The primary purpose of security questioning is to establish that you are a safe, non-violent, legal traveler. Of course, security agents can't ask you this directly, so they ask this through proxy questions. Varnull did not understand this, and when asked the proxy questions, he gave vague answers and did not address the primary purpose. When the questions became personal, Var…

So it's the duty of the interrogated person to know how to give good answers to security questions and not the security personnel's duty to ask good questions?

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#117

Post by Cpoll »

dang wrote: post #114
Cpoll wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> On HN, commenters have a personal identity (which of course can be a pseudonym if you want). If some users want a site where there are no such identities, only free-floating comments with comment IDs, they should find or create such a site and participate there instead. There's room for lots of different kinds of internet forums. HN is just one kind, but it is that kind, and the reason we have moderation, including…

I don't want most of those posts to disappear either. The moderation comments you're referring to are more targeted than that.

Fair enough. There's selection bias on my end, and even then I can't find much fault.

Thanks for keeping the gears oiled around here :)

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#118

Post by vilmosi »

valbaca wrote: post #95
no_acc_recovery wrote: post #89

I have the full sympathy to the guy. That said I am at loss what is it to do with Ramadan? I have not seen a single statement that his ordeal has anything to do with Ramadan but it just happened during Ramadan. Otherwise this is happening to all walks of life including white dudes (though much much less frequently). Just a catchy title? edit: my objection is to the title not the content.

Fasting is a major part of Ramadan. The whole ordeal took several stressful hours during which he was starved and dehydrated.

We wasn't following Ramadan, he's Hindu.

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#119

Post by burger_moon »

dang wrote: post #64
burger_moon wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That last discussion was a shit show of people one-upping each other in the oppression olympics. It seems like as soon as you compare one persons experience to being not as bad or worse than another persons the entire thread devolves into terrible accusations and comparisons.

That second sentence would make a good HN comment. The first one is pointlessly inflammatory; please don't do that here.

I'm sorry you feel that way. It's a perfect characterization of how most non-technical comment threads threads go on here however.

Re: Don't Fly During Ramadan (2013)

#120

Post by Dangisbiased »

dang wrote: post #67
thr3290 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you ever cross international border? My reading is just fine, read the article. He was 'fasting' before security check. And he should say it is a medical emergency, if he felt like passing out.

Please don't create many obscure throwaway accounts; we ban those. HN is a community. Anonymity is fine, but users should have some consistent identity that other users can relate to. Otherwise we may as well have no usernames and no community, and that would be an entirely different forum.

Can you stop doing everything you can to make people hate science. Stop being elitist maybe?
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