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John Glenn has died

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Re: John Glenn has died

#111

RIP. I have to wonder, these first missions, did the astronauts have any assurance they would make it back to earth? What was it like to say goodbye to family, not knowing if you would return or not. Am I way off here? Was this mission uncertain or did NASA have reasonable assurances?

I would be very surprised if _any_ astronaut feels assured they will come home. I'm sure they don't talk about it much, but there's got to be that little voice telling them there's a chance... And yet, they still go.

History is full of people knowingly taking such risks.

For example, my father was a B17 navigator. 80% of the group he went to England with became casualties. He was convinced he would not survive his tour due to the inevitable mathematics of the B-17 loss rate.

But he went anyway.

Re: John Glenn has died

#112

He was an amazing man. Fun fact: the most popular years for babies named Glenn and John was 1962 and 1963 respectively [0,1], and you can see a little spike in births for both around the time John Glenn orbited the earth. Glenn entered the NASA test program without the required degree in a scientific field. He was the oldest man to fly in space, at age 77, and one of the last people to receive a ticker tape parade (t…

>He was the oldest man to fly in space, at age 77

My (then teenaged) brother had a change to meet John in the early 90s. He asked him, "Why don't you go back to space?" and suggested he go back up if the opportunity presented itself.

We'll never know if that had any bearing on John Glenn's decision to return (maybe he already planned to I don't know), but I like to think it certainly did. Maybe just hearing the idea out loud, even from a teen, made the thought of it less crazy.

Re: John Glenn has died

#113

This deserves a black bar (IMO) John Glenn was very influential on me as a student. He gave a talk at my high school about how learning as much as you could prepared you for the unexpected. He certainly put that to the test (as all of the astronauts then and now) do. The stakes are high, the resources limited, and time for a solution is finite. God speed John Glenn.

I agree.

Re: John Glenn has died

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be very surprised if _any_ astronaut feels assured they will come home. I'm sure they don't talk about it much, but there's got to be that little voice telling them there's a chance... And yet, they still go.

History is full of people knowingly taking such risks. For example, my father was a B17 navigator. 80% of the group he went to England with became casualties. He was convinced he would not survive his tour due to the inevitable mathematics of the B-17 loss rate. But he went anyway.

I just read that Glenn flew 149 combat missions, including ones where he got his plane back home all shot up. He had no shortage of bravery and willingness to take huge risks.

Re: John Glenn has died

#116

I grew up next to mission control and many of my neighbors and friends' parents were involved in Mission Control and/or Astronauts or both. Oddly, in the middle of nowhere Texas - Clear Lake. This gave me some interesting run-ins with cosmonauts, astronauts, physicists etc... I was lucky enough to meet John Glenn on 3 separate occasions. The first time, I discussed Plutonium 238 and my worries for satellite power giv…

> humanity has lost the Lee Iacocca of Space Perhaps you could explain the comparison to a somewhat famous car company executive ...

It's a dated reference, but I can shed some light on this. I'm from Detroit and my dad worked at Chrysler basically his entire adult life. Lee Iacocca was the rockstar of the automotive world before Elon Musk hit the scene. As an exec and former engineer at Ford, he spearheaded the development of the mustang among many other accomplishments.

After leaving Ford, I guess he needed a challenge and took on the ordeal of turning around Chrysler, which was about to go out of business in the late '70's. He personally secured cash from Congress for a bailout (Yeah I know, this sounds familiar). In the 80's after turning Chrysler around, he would appear in commercials saying something like "You can't find a better car. If you do, buy it." Since he saved my Dad's job and livelihood, he kinda worshipped him and that reverence trickled down a bit to me.

EDIT: I do find it a bit sad that fewer of us work for CEO's that we personally look up to. This is probably one major factor in what inspires the entrepreneurial spirit in many of us. The main reason that I want to work for an Elon Musk company is that I'm tired of being a cynic in a post-modern world and want to be a part of a vision greater than 140 characters or self-driving cars.

Unexpected personal reflection: As I'm writing this, I'm beginning to empathize with the coal miners and manufacturing workers who believe in Trump. I know people aren't fans of bailouts and as a student of Economics I'm generally opposed to them as well. However, The automotive industry was and is still so deeply intertwined with the fabric of Detroit and Southeast Michigan in general that losing those companies, once the shining example of American manufacturing exceptionalism, would be a crippling blow to the collective consciousness of all the residents there.You don't simply see it as some efficient restructuring and reallocation of capital if they go out of business. Those automotive roots run deep and when Chrysler faced bankruptcy again after the financial crisis, even though he was retired at the time, we both felt like an extension of ourselves was on life support. If it had cratered, it would've been a massive blow to our psyche similar I guess to how one would feel if an army had razed your city. When an industry is so closely related to your community, it becomes a part of your identity. Chrysler basically allowed for me to attend an elite private high school and university. In principle, I still disagree with trying to revive the coal industry (that American manufacturing strength is dead is complete fiction. I would argue that the USA is still the leader in global manufacturing because it's done without polluting the shit out of the environment), but I guess now I'm willing to listen to their side with an open ear and am open to some sort of environmentally responsible compromise.

That's the thing about heroes, even in death they can inspire change. Godspeed, John Glenn.

Re: John Glenn has died

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> humanity has lost the Lee Iacocca of Space Perhaps you could explain the comparison to a somewhat famous car company executive ...

John Glenn was an engineer. Lee Iacocca was an engineer. Elon Musk is not an engineer.

Yet, "In order to be an engineer, it is not enough to be an engineer." Jose Ortega y Gasset.

No profession has a monopoly on competence.

Re: John Glenn has died

#118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's a black bar?

Blacking out the orange bar at the top of the site. Traditionally done in mourning.

You know, I was wondering what site. Perhaps, it's some sort of an orange thing on the launch site (of rockets). The sudden context switch of parent comments talking about astronauts got me :-)

I've never seen the orange bar being blacked out recently (since I've been a member).

Glenn does seem like a swell guy!

Edit: fix typos

Re: John Glenn has died

#119
post #48

I think he deserves a black bar if anyone does.

I certainly wont complain if we do put up a black bar for Glenn, but at the same time I feel like the black bar should represent a death of someone who directly contributed or was actively a part of the hacker community. While Glenn was immensely inspirational, he never really felt like a part of who we are.

People like John Glenn are the reason why I became infatuated with the space program and STEM. He showed the heights humanity could reach by using science and knowledge to become masters of our own destiny instead of victims of nature and fate. Before personal computers, before the Internet, before cellphones, humans landed on the moon & live streamed it to 600 million people. I feel the same way for artists like William Gibson and Neal Stephenson. It's become fashionable for many to deride the value of a non-STEM education. But if it weren't for them and their creation of the cyberpunk ethos and genre, I'd most likely be working at a bank or a hedge fund in a decidely non-technical role.

I also highly commend and greatly respect him for his efforts in nuclear non-proliferation. I imagine when you've seen earth from the view he had, you can't help seeing how small our differences actually are. That said, he wasn't perfect. His testimony in favor of excluding women from the astronaut program kept them from going on a mission until the 80's. To his credit, by the 1970's he had changed his mind and began supporting a female astronaut (Judith Resnick...interestingly she was recruited into the program by none than Lt. Uhura/Nichelle Nichols ) in her endeavors to join the astronaut program. Ultimately and unfortunately, she was a member of the ill-fated Challenger crew. Glenn gave a touching and inspirational speech at her memorial service that is worth reading: https://www.nasa.gov/centers/glenn/about/memorial.html

Off topic rant: As I hear this news, I'm reminded of the whole Buzz Aldrin dustup. While I'm no advocate of violence, I was inspired when he decked that looney conspiracy theorist who claimed the moon landings were faked. Despite the fact that you can literally shine lasers on the pieces of spacecraft left on the Moon and see the reflections, there are still those forces of ignorance who refuse to accept reality even as it stares them right in the eye. Most people in his position and especially at his age would simply try to avoid that confrontation and be content to let charlatans spread their destructive, nonsensical fictions. John Glenn was not that man. For some reason, that incident is what truly sticks out in my mind about him and I always associate him with this image: http://www.themarysue.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/3779149.... It's probably because I associate him with being the last of a dying breed, a modern hero in an increasingly cynical, post-modern society.

Re: John Glenn has died

#120
post #14

John Glenn was one of my boyhood heroes. I remember as a young boy listening to reports of him taking off and making those three orbits of the earth. My uncle gave me a crystal radio shaped like Glenn's Friendship 7 capsule that ignited a fierce passion into radio that led to a ham radio license and a lifelong interest in science. It was a time in America when the future seemed endless, anything was possible. A lot h…

>It was a time in America when the future seemed endless, anything was possible. Somewhere between "We choose to go to the moon" and "if you see something, say something" we traded all of our hope and optimism for fear and suspicion. I'm just hoping for hope again.

> Somewhere between "We choose to go to the moon" and "if you see something, say something" we traded all of our hope and optimism for fear and suspicion.

We chose to go to the moon because we were afraid (afraid of Communism, afraid of the Russians, afraid of the Cold War).

That doesn't mean great things can only come about as the result of fear and suspicion, but it's not like the Space Race was a great example of hope and optimism in contrast with fear and suspicion.

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