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Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

nature.com

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Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#111

Post by zepn »

reasonattlm wrote: post #27

If you go digging around you'll find dozens of other similar results in the past five to ten years for dozens of various compounds, some of which produce larger effect sizes than this one. This is nothing to get excited over. It is interesting the way in which various groups leap upon some research reports but not others. The challenge is always having the context for the broader state of research to understand wheth…

Just because I agree with most of your points and there seem to be some overexcited responses to the OP, here are two papers for anyone interested, summarising Aβ and tau [0] and some failures of Aβ therapies [1].

[0] http://www.nature.com/nrn/journal/v12/n2/abs/nrn2967.html [1] http://www.nature.com/nrneurol/journal/v9/n12/full/nrneurol....

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#112

Post by fao_ »

bitJericho wrote: post #88
Zigurd wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people are quite cynical about Big Pharma

Yes, those people don't experiment with dangerous chemicals, instead they happily give their dollars to big placebo!

Being cynical about 'Big Pharma' does not mean that you support placebos, and does not mean that you do not support honest scientific efforts.

For example, Ben Goldacre. He is cynical about 'Big Pharma', and has written about it in one of his books[0]. At the same time he appears to support efforts to open up private medical research -- he recently cofounded AllTrials[2] along with the BMJ, Cochrane, PLOS, and a few other high-profile reputable sources[3].

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bad_Pharma [1]: http://www.cochrane.org/ [2]: http://www.alltrials.net/ [3]: http://www.phc.ox.ac.uk/news/ben-goldacre-joins-oxford-unive...

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#113

Post by DenisM »

ckarmann wrote: post #70
jupp0r wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not an expert, but human lifespans have only risen to relevant heights very recently. It's simply not enough time for it for evolution to kick in.

For evolution, what is important is that you survive and have good health long enough to have offsprings. The vast majority of people, even in modern times, have their children before 50 years old (because women have this hard limit in their fertility). So there was never an evolution pressure to make our body function propertly after that time.

Children who don't have extended family, such as grandparents, to care for them are more likely to die, either of of predators (if parents are out hunting) or of hunger (if parents stick around to protect their children).

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#114

Post by DenisM »

daveguy wrote: post #78

I would like to point out that the main study described in this article is not the "inject aggregated amyloid beta fibrils" that is described first. That study was a preliminary study that prompted the main study which uses genetically altered mice. The test for alzheimers for the first study (previously reported but summarized again) was to quantify how much the mice deviates from solving a maze that they have been…

Excellent summary for those of us without enough will or ability to read the original article. Thank you, good sir.

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#115

Post by nonbel »

muddyrivers wrote: post #99
Kapow wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, talk about cherry-picking. And those both resulted in jail time. How about the "unfortunate history" of falsified research in other countries? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_misconduct#Notable_... Do you feel the same way about US scientific research?

If the research misconducts are from Japan, China and South Korean, they would immediately become the top news in the major media in USA. If they are from Western countries, well, most of them didn't even get mentioned in the same media. That is how unbiased these media are. BTW, I am not even talking about Fox News and alike. NYT, you are in the list. The journalistic integrity of your articles has been dropping lik…

Here is what happened when someone was believed to have committed scientific fraud in the US: http://retractionwatch.com/2015/11/07/its-official-anil-pott...

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#116

Post by jonnathanson »

daveguy wrote: post #63
jonnathanson wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Average life expectancy is a commonly misunderstood (and widely misrepresented) concept. We hear things like "Humans really only lived into their 40s in the Stone Age," or what have you. This is untrue. Average (arithmetic mean) life expectancy was a lot lower because it was heavily skewed by infant mortality. Up until very recently, many more babies died within their first few years of life. We've dramatically impro…

"That said, the prevalance of diseases like Alzheimer's might be a fairly modern aberration, perhaps owing to lifestyle, environmental, and dietary factors." Also somewhat owing to the recognition of Alzheimer's as a disease state (coincident with amyloid beta plaques) rather than just part of "getting old". The difference between "more prevalent" and "better identified" is difficult to determine.

That's a totally fair point.

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#117

Post by warfangle »

PixelB wrote: post #62
bro-stick wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mouse models are rapidly becoming obsolete as it's becoming easier than ever to model entire, differentiated tissues grown from red blood cell-derived adult stem cells. It's also now possible to do clinically-useful testing of targeted treatments using genetically-edited control tissue cultures against unedited tissue cultures. The point is that it's better to test something that is as close to the patient as possibl…

>>Mouse models are rapidly becoming obsolete as it's becoming easier than ever to model entire, differentiated tissues grown from red blood cell-derived adult stem cells. No they aren't. Transgenic mouse models are a $billion industry. We do not understand biological mechanisms nearly enough to not use live animal models. We are not even able to recreate single cell organisms with our level of knowledge and engineeri…

Not only that .... chopping off heads isn't how mice are terminated, from what I've been told by someone who worked in fetal development research on mice.

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#118

Post by wobbleblob »

blisterpeanuts wrote: post #46

This is heartening news; if not a cure, at least it suggests a promising avenue for future research into this terrible condition. This LiveScience[1] article is an easily read summary that also mentions a critique of the approach. Given the unfortunate history[2][3] of falsified Korean scientific research, it would be prudent to withhold judgment until these results have been reproduced in other labs around the world…

Ever since a family member was diagnosed with Alzheimer's, I've been paying attention to reports like these. Every other year, there is a paper about a major breakthrough, and surely a cure should be just around the corner any time now.

Every few years there is a paper that claims that we now finally know what causes the disease, and every time it's something different, and every time you never hear of a followup.

It's about 3 decades later now, and as far as I can tell, there is still no actual progress in the way of treatment. An alzheimer's diagnosis still means the same as it did in the 80's or in the 60's for that matter.

About this cure that is just around the corner. It came too late for my grandparents generation, it came too late for my parents' generation, it came too late for my generation, I wouldn't be surprised if it came too late for my children's generation. I don't believe in it any more.

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#119

Post by Zigurd »

tptacek wrote: post #55
Zigurd wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people are quite cynical about Big Pharma

How many of those people would trade the portfolio of medications available today for those available in 1955?

Nobody, of course. But would you prefer not to have drugs of dubious effectiveness marketed like consumer products? It's not an either or choice.

Re: Chemical clears Alzheimer's protein and restores memory in mice

#120

Post by kiba »

muddyrivers wrote: post #99
Kapow wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, talk about cherry-picking. And those both resulted in jail time. How about the "unfortunate history" of falsified research in other countries? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_misconduct#Notable_... Do you feel the same way about US scientific research?

If the research misconducts are from Japan, China and South Korean, they would immediately become the top news in the major media in USA. If they are from Western countries, well, most of them didn't even get mentioned in the same media. That is how unbiased these media are. BTW, I am not even talking about Fox News and alike. NYT, you are in the list. The journalistic integrity of your articles has been dropping lik…

It seemed like everybody's journalistic integrity was dropping like a rock.
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