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BitPay and PayPal

blog.bitpay.com

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Re: BitPay and PayPal

#101

Post by drcross »

jarek wrote: post #86
aianus wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Small global market share for legal uses. How do you know? It's currently small because it's currently impossible. > Most non-US residents can do bank transfers as fast as Bitcoin or will be able to Real Soon Now. I disagree, most non-US residents in the world don't even have bank accounts . Not to mention, the US and Canada are a huge market with a terrible banking system that refuses to modernize. > So like 5%? 5…

> How do you know? It's currently small because it's currently impossible. I think the reason for my belief about iPhones-in-Nigeria being a small market is self-evident. As for other examples: people tend to buy things locally because local businesses are generally good at recognizing local demand, organizing import if necessary, and reaping the benefits of scale (shipping a container of phones). That this arrangeme…

Fiat currency is printed on the whim of governments, effectively defrauding the citizens of every country in the world through value dilution. Bitcoin is a technological innovation which allows for a constant and known rate of currency generation. I'd prefer to intrust my pension to maths than to a civil servant with an economics degree. This aspect shouldn't be overlooked or taken lighty because it disrupts the power, ergo the control that governments can wield over their citizens.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#102

Post by drcross »

jbooth wrote: post #98
mbesto wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will cost less to transport money and align the exchange amount of currencies with real market value.

Wha?? How is something that flips up and down by several hundred percent over a given quarter-year going to 'align the exchange amount of currencies with real market value'? What does that even mean? Like the billion-dollar currency trading industry isn't doing that already, we need one more currency to get it just right?

As the pool of liquidity increases the price volatility decreases. When you compare the early charts to now there are smaller RELATIVE price swings.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#103

Post by drcross »

u124556 wrote: post #70
sillysaurus3 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because someone can point a gun at your head to defeat ECC. They can't do that with banks. That's why people keep their life savings in a bank, and why you'll need a bank even with Bitcoin.

I always felt bitcoin was more about replacing paper money than replacing banks. Banks give you interests, Bitcoin just sits there and the amount (in bitcoins) never changes.

The interest you get rarely beats the cost of the dilution of your currencies value through printing of new money.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#104

Post by jarek »

drcross wrote: post #101
jarek wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How do you know? It's currently small because it's currently impossible. I think the reason for my belief about iPhones-in-Nigeria being a small market is self-evident. As for other examples: people tend to buy things locally because local businesses are generally good at recognizing local demand, organizing import if necessary, and reaping the benefits of scale (shipping a container of phones). That this arrangeme…

Fiat currency is printed on the whim of governments, effectively defrauding the citizens of every country in the world through value dilution. Bitcoin is a technological innovation which allows for a constant and known rate of currency generation. I'd prefer to intrust my pension to maths than to a civil servant with an economics degree. This aspect shouldn't be overlooked or taken lighty because it disrupts the powe…

> Fiat currency is printed on the whim of governments, effectively defrauding the citizens of every country in the world through value dilution. Bitcoin is a technological innovation which allows for a constant and known rate of currency generation. I'd prefer to intrust my pension to maths than to a civil servant with an economics degree. This aspect shouldn't be overlooked or taken lighty because it disrupts the power, ergo the control that governments can wield over their citizens.

Yawn. If people as a whole cared about 1% of what you just said there'd be revolutions in every country yesterday.

Money is inherently a social thing. You provide goods or services today to earn a social credit and be able to acquire goods and services after you retire. Your pension is useless without an economy made up of ordinary people who don't care about maths and cryptography but feel they owe you something. They only care about power governments can wield over citizens when things go really wrong. And when things go really wrong you can't buy potatoes with a hard drive.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#105

Post by joshuaxls »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #99
joshuaxls wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, you're right. The point is, with bitcoin, there's really no need for banks. It's easier (and safer) for me to hold a million dollars in bitcoin than a million dollars in cash. If I had a million dollars in cash, I'd be constantly worried that someone will find it and steal it. Hence the need for a bank. I feel much more capable hiding a private key, which is just information, than I do hiding 10,000 pieces of pa…

Its not about need. Its about somebody paying you interest on your money. To the degree bitcoins don't pay interest, they are less valuable than hard currencies.

No one opens a bank account for the interest paid. Most accounts barely pay a tenth of a percent annually, maybe a quarter percent from a credit union—meanwhile, inflation is 2% a year. You’re losing net worth by holding USD in a bank account.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#106

Post by martindale »

fdsary wrote: post #100
trevordev wrote: post #14

BitPay sponsored angel-hack Seattle that I participated in this summer. Their developer api was horrible and poorly documented wasting everyone time. I was in one of the few groups that got it to work. When asking when we would find out who won the 5 bitcoin prize for best use of it we were told to contact bitpay. I contacted them multiple times and support told me to to contact their CEO who ended up not responding…

I'm developing an app now, where bitcoin payments are part of it. I decided to try bitpay rather than running bitciond myself (less chance to fuck up) but their API is horribly hard to use, gives inconsistent errors and the docs are awful at best. I'm using their old version, but the errors I get are from the new version. Their library for the language I use is not yet updated. The new docs seem to be better, but I l…

Hey! Thanks for taking the time to share your feedback. What language are you using, and what errors are you getting?

Always feel free to shoot me an email at eric@bitpay.com.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#107

Post by aianus »

jarek wrote: post #104
drcross wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fiat currency is printed on the whim of governments, effectively defrauding the citizens of every country in the world through value dilution. Bitcoin is a technological innovation which allows for a constant and known rate of currency generation. I'd prefer to intrust my pension to maths than to a civil servant with an economics degree. This aspect shouldn't be overlooked or taken lighty because it disrupts the powe…

> Fiat currency is printed on the whim of governments, effectively defrauding the citizens of every country in the world through value dilution. Bitcoin is a technological innovation which allows for a constant and known rate of currency generation. I'd prefer to intrust my pension to maths than to a civil servant with an economics degree. This aspect shouldn't be overlooked or taken lighty because it disrupts the po…

There are numerous examples in history (and today!) of governments wiping out their citizens' savings through hyperinflation, restricting their access to foreign currencies, etc. This is not just an ideological libertarian conspiracy theory.

It is a virtue of Bitcoin that it helps subvert the power of those corrupt governments over the economy in much the same way TOR and proxies help to subvert their power over free speech.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#108

Post by aianus »

jarek wrote: post #86
aianus wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Small global market share for legal uses. How do you know? It's currently small because it's currently impossible. > Most non-US residents can do bank transfers as fast as Bitcoin or will be able to Real Soon Now. I disagree, most non-US residents in the world don't even have bank accounts . Not to mention, the US and Canada are a huge market with a terrible banking system that refuses to modernize. > So like 5%? 5…

> How do you know? It's currently small because it's currently impossible. I think the reason for my belief about iPhones-in-Nigeria being a small market is self-evident. As for other examples: people tend to buy things locally because local businesses are generally good at recognizing local demand, organizing import if necessary, and reaping the benefits of scale (shipping a container of phones). That this arrangeme…

> No - but as a price-sensitive customer I would buy a couple-months-old, gently-used Macbook and save $200 or more. As a price-sensitive business I would buy a Dell.

Given the number of successful 1-2% cash-back credit cards, it would seem that even regular consumers care about saving tiny fractions on their spending.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#109

Post by aianus »

jarek wrote: post #76
aianus wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slightly snarky but true retort: Soylent takes Bitcoin.

Cool, that only leaves people who provide supplies to Soylent, people who ship the Soylent to you, and your water utility :)

Would you make fun of the Burundian Franc because I'd have to convert them into USD to pay my US suppliers? Not everyone has to directly accept Bitcoin for it to be a real currency and generally useful.

The only difference with Bitcoin versus a small fiat currency is the people who are using it are distributed geographically worldwide instead of clumped together in one area. As long as they continue to prefer it to other currencies for some proportion of their transactions it will be successful and have value.

Re: BitPay and PayPal

#110

Post by tim333 »

tomatocracy wrote: post #92
tim333 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not totally sure about the US case but in the UK you are technically liable for capital gains tax on foreign currency appreciation so if I buy US$ at 1.60 to the £ and buy a cup of coffee when for $2 when it's 1.40 to the £ I should declare the 20c or so appreciation in my dollars in pound terms. In practice no one bothers for small sums and if you've made a gain of say £10k you can estimate an average rate rathe…

True, except it's not only that people don't bother to report holiday cash transactions - there are formal exemptions from capital gains tax in the UK for (i) cash which is for personal use while travelling outside the UK and (ii) (since 2012) for all foreign currency bank accounts. In terms of what most people do, it's only if you hold or use the currency for investment purposes that you need to worry. HMRC initiall…

Most stuff that makes money gets taxed. The HMRC exempt investment in cars and gambling because they figure most people lose on those. Guess that goes for holiday money too as the money change fees probably exceed currency gains. Dunno if you could classify bitcoin as gambling on the value of some inherently worthless bits? Might have a chance with that one.
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