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Svbtle Funding

blog.svbtle.com

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Re: Svbtle Funding

#101

Post by nchlswu »

kami8845 wrote: post #70
pg wrote: post #53

Svbtle is probably one of the most misunderstood companies we've funded. Partly because what they're doing is hard to understand, and partly because Dustin has alienated a few people along the way, who now in the usual way with haters want to misunderstand what Svbtle is. One of the reasons Svbtle is hard to understand is that it's a work in progress. At its current fairly fuzzy resolution, it's what I'd guess a trad…

I think a lot of the initial dislike stems from the svbtle/obtvse thing, where Dustin went into all-out-rage because someone cloned what amounted to not-much-more than a Wordpress theme. That and the air of superiority within the announcement: svbtle would only be used by people who are "intelligent and witty" implying that everyone who couldn't, wasn't.

It definitely stems from both factors you mentioned. No one really knows who Dustin is and he's established a brand as a person who aspires for the best and is very opinionated. For better or for worse, most commenters only really know that about him. His response to the Svbtle clones on top of the personality he added to the Svbtle announement really acted as a tipping point for most peoples' perceptions about him.

Unfortunately, like you allude to, most people also saw his reaction simply to being a stolen theme, and don't appreciate that it was intended to be much more than that.

The network's introduction introduced Dustin's concept and site. If you ever visited his blog before that, it's clear he was building the site before. Part of the introduction was sharing a novel approach to the blogging workflow and get a glimpse of the CMS. If it's "just a theme," you'd imagine that people would steal some of the more interesting things, like his approach to editing, or build on it. Instead, people insisted on duplicating the theme -- some just to spite Dustin.

Dustin was explicit about his goals in the beginning - to create a great publishing/blogging network. If yoiu look at how it's panned out, people are making Svbtle their personal blogs and the theme is the differentiator. writers were willing to forego a complete branding of their website and demonstrated they were willing to accept this brand. When you're working to build a brand and key piece is plagiarized (and subsequently insulted by people who don't understand the work that goes behind it), the reaction is a bit more understandable.

I'm being polite. I recognize that it interpretations may differ

Re: Svbtle Funding

#102

Post by addlepate »

I know this makes me sound like yet another asshole, and I guess that's what I am, but it's sad that the stuff on Svbtle is considered by anyone to be good writing. Much less a large group of smart people.

Re: Svbtle Funding

#103

Post by pg »

waterlesscloud wrote: post #85
pg wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think not. Haters are distinctive enough that it would make the language less expressive to discard the word and merge it into "critic." I'm slow to adopt new words, but I think "hater" is a useful addition to the language, and not simply a pejorative version of "critic." The difference is that a critic is what you're called as a byproduct of being critical in a particular instance, whereas being a hater is an ongo…

Then isn't the word "haters" misapplied here? What I've seen in this thread is that people have reasons for disliking Dustin, some of which directly relate to Svbtle. To the extent that they don't directly relate, though, people are quite explicitly saying they evaluate Svbtle separate from Dustin. And by far the most common reaction expressed is a lack of understanding any valid business model for the network, which…

HN users are sophisticated enough not to simply post comments saying "I hate Dustin Curtis." Here they resort to something more akin to concern trolling.

The way you can tell something is amiss is the volume of commenters who seem worried about e.g. how Dustin is going to make money. If most startups issued such a bland funding announcement, it would sink beneath the surface of HN with barely a ripple of comment.

Re: Svbtle Funding

#104

Post by hornbaker »

huhtenberg wrote: post #80
pg wrote: post #53

Svbtle is probably one of the most misunderstood companies we've funded. Partly because what they're doing is hard to understand, and partly because Dustin has alienated a few people along the way, who now in the usual way with haters want to misunderstand what Svbtle is. One of the reasons Svbtle is hard to understand is that it's a work in progress. At its current fairly fuzzy resolution, it's what I'd guess a trad…

> hate I suspect that a good chunk of hate comes from that Kudos widget not having an Undo. It comes across as cocky, hence the backlash.

It has an undo, but it could be more discoverable. Click and hold on the Kudos button for a couple of seconds, then release, and the count will go back down. Works on Chrome and iOS Safari for me.

Re: Svbtle Funding

#105

Post by pclark »

huhtenberg wrote: post #80
pg wrote: post #53

Svbtle is probably one of the most misunderstood companies we've funded. Partly because what they're doing is hard to understand, and partly because Dustin has alienated a few people along the way, who now in the usual way with haters want to misunderstand what Svbtle is. One of the reasons Svbtle is hard to understand is that it's a work in progress. At its current fairly fuzzy resolution, it's what I'd guess a trad…

> hate I suspect that a good chunk of hate comes from that Kudos widget not having an Undo. It comes across as cocky, hence the backlash.

Hacker News doesn't have an undo button for upvotes and no one seems to care.

Re: Svbtle Funding

#106

Post by _b8r0 »

pg wrote: post #53

Svbtle is probably one of the most misunderstood companies we've funded. Partly because what they're doing is hard to understand, and partly because Dustin has alienated a few people along the way, who now in the usual way with haters want to misunderstand what Svbtle is. One of the reasons Svbtle is hard to understand is that it's a work in progress. At its current fairly fuzzy resolution, it's what I'd guess a trad…

How does Svbtle distinguish itself from any of the other blogging networks that emerged towards the end of the last decade?

Looking at the front page and at Ethan Kaplan's posts in an unscientific way it appears as though everyones posts on Svbtle make the front page (although I could be wrong and if so please say so - I didn't take a particularly large sample). I'm not sure where the curation is.

It seems that anyone can apply to join svbtle, but it's not clear why they'd choose to versus hosting their own blog or writing online for traditional print outlets.

Is there an editorial process for posts on Svbtle?

I ask this because I want to get my head around what makes it special compared to other blog networks. I don't really care who Dustin is (one of the benefits of not being in the valley I guess) or what he's done/not done.

Re: Svbtle Funding

#107

Post by heartbreak »

kevinalexbrown wrote: post #82

When people suggest this is a stupid idea, I think there's a profound misunderstanding of how enticing exclusivity is. Not everyone gets to send a piece in to the NYTimes, the WSJ, the National Review and get it published as an op-ed. But for someone in political science or macroeconomics it's definitely a status symbol. Note that anyone could just as easily put something on their own blog. In fact, many people who r…

That's the problem with Svbtle. You can't just "be" that. You have to earn it.

Re: Svbtle Funding

#108

Post by jessaustin »

mnicole wrote: post #79
bri3d wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had Dustin simply made suggestions, he'd be trying to help the brand. Instead, he made it personal and demeaned the livelihood of professionals he'd never met. After he received a response, he then went on to make more backhanded jabs, for example saying he was "surprised" that the other designer's work actually looked good. Telling an unfamiliar company to "fire designers" he hadn't interacted with wasn't helping a…

The idea that anyone on HN is innocent of making statements similar to those he did are laughable, and posts just like them make the front page and are the most-upvoted every day. Are people not allowed to have opinions anymore? It isn't like they hired him to clean up house and that was his approach; he saw a terrible user experience and he gave his advice on how to fix it. Often times, starting fresh is the best wa…

I have no opinion of Sᴧbtle, but I can't fault Curtis's conduct in this episode. He offered a completely valid critique of the antiquated web presence of a large and poorly-managed company. When he received a response from someone involved in the production process, he republished it w̶i̶t̶h̶ ̶r̶e̶s̶p̶e̶c̶t̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶c̶o̶r̶d̶i̶a̶l̶i̶t̶y̶ [edit: OK that was a bit strong] cordially. It is unfortunate that someone lost a job in a knee-jerk corporate response to that candid exchange. Everyone likes to be employed, but I doubt even that UX person will admit to having lost a good job. I hope the next employer snapped up the person promptly, and I hope that the new organization is much less dysfunctional. Whatever the case, Curtis is responsible neither for the poor culture at AA nor for the erstwhile employee's poor anticipation of the probable response of that culture.

In the meantime, I'll be unchecking "AA" on the sidebar of the Kayak site for the foreseeable future.

Re: Svbtle Funding

#109

Post by tptacek »

heartbreak wrote: post #107
kevinalexbrown wrote: post #82

When people suggest this is a stupid idea, I think there's a profound misunderstanding of how enticing exclusivity is. Not everyone gets to send a piece in to the NYTimes, the WSJ, the National Review and get it published as an op-ed. But for someone in political science or macroeconomics it's definitely a status symbol. Note that anyone could just as easily put something on their own blog. In fact, many people who r…

That's the problem with Svbtle. You can't just "be" that. You have to earn it.

Says exactly who, and with what evidence?

Re: Svbtle Funding

#110

Post by tomkin »

pg wrote: post #53

Svbtle is probably one of the most misunderstood companies we've funded. Partly because what they're doing is hard to understand, and partly because Dustin has alienated a few people along the way, who now in the usual way with haters want to misunderstand what Svbtle is. One of the reasons Svbtle is hard to understand is that it's a work in progress. At its current fairly fuzzy resolution, it's what I'd guess a trad…

I think most people separate Svbtle from Dustin, although I don't think Dustin necessary is advocating for this separation himself. You can see this in the comments. When people are being critical, it generally leans towards Dustin and not the product. When people are boasting Svtble, they rarely mention Dustin. There's a reason for that.

It was clear to most that Dustin was expecting adoration and when that didn't happen, the conversation changed.

I don't know how many tweets, posts and "thoughts" I read where Dustin was "abandoning HN" or laying claim to "the downfall of HN"[2], only to end up back here posting some other ego-laden[3] dribble.

"You're welcome", I believe is what used to be on the footer of Svtble. Really gets me thinking about how modest he is.

[1] http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3749035

[2] https://twitter.com/dcurtis/status/182986897444966402

[3] https://twitter.com/dcurtis/status/183394426914217984

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