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Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

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Re: Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

#101

Post by Levitating »

benjiro29 wrote: post #23
rdtsc wrote: post #7

> The company plans to grab four categories: your sleep, your medications, your medical records, and your cycle tracking details So you buy a device but you can't effectively use half of its features because you'd also have to agree to send them your medical records? Ok then if I refuse, will they refund 50% of the device price since now it's not usable any more?

If your in EU, you contact the local EU consumer group where you buy the device. https://www.europe-consommateurs.eu/en/who-we-are/about-us/e... And file a complaint... As that breaches a dozen or more EU laws. If a lot of people do it in all the countries, it becomes a national issue. That is the only way you fix things, and yes, we have had multiple successes with companies taking the piss. Even Samsung can not esc…

How about people just stop buying this crap instead? I've never owned a Samsung and I never will.

People need to step out of this abusive relationship instead of trying to improve it. You will never be happy with a device you don't own.

Re: Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

#103

Post by akramachamarei »

anonymars wrote: post #79
skeledrew wrote: post #64

This actually seems kinda OK. Consent to train is payment for hosting that data. Find another health app/service with more preferable terms if you don't like it. My only beef is if they do an immediate delete without providing a reasonable method for users to export that data first, which is how it reads.

> Find another health app/service with more preferable terms if you don't like it It never ceases to amaze me how many people defend the Darth Vader style of buying a product: "I am altering the deal; pray I don't alter it any further" I assume it must be rooted in the just-world fallacy: "Clearly anyone affected must not have been careful enough or did something else wrong. Since I'm careful with my purchases, negat…

Your analysis reiterates the popular but fallacious motifs. The real issue is that people don't read the contracts they sign, so when they buy something they imagine that it will do all they expect and probably more from the time they buy until it falls apart. Then they're surprised when Samsung does something permitted by the contract. Then they get annoyed because they feel entitled to something that no one agreed to.

This seems to be a major stumbling block in the popular understanding of business: contracts, agreement, consent matters.

What you might be implying with the reference to the JWF is that there should be a ceiling for retail contract complexity. I'm just guessing, it's not really clear.

Re: Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

#104

Post by red-iron-pine »

Levitating wrote: post #101
benjiro29 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your in EU, you contact the local EU consumer group where you buy the device. https://www.europe-consommateurs.eu/en/who-we-are/about-us/e... And file a complaint... As that breaches a dozen or more EU laws. If a lot of people do it in all the countries, it becomes a national issue. That is the only way you fix things, and yes, we have had multiple successes with companies taking the piss. Even Samsung can not esc…

How about people just stop buying this crap instead? I've never owned a Samsung and I never will. People need to step out of this abusive relationship instead of trying to improve it. You will never be happy with a device you don't own.

point me to some mature, effective options and I'd consider it.

now that you've done that, which ones are cheap, cuz most people are broke af

Re: Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

#105

Post by alyeska »

Levitating wrote: post #101
benjiro29 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your in EU, you contact the local EU consumer group where you buy the device. https://www.europe-consommateurs.eu/en/who-we-are/about-us/e... And file a complaint... As that breaches a dozen or more EU laws. If a lot of people do it in all the countries, it becomes a national issue. That is the only way you fix things, and yes, we have had multiple successes with companies taking the piss. Even Samsung can not esc…

How about people just stop buying this crap instead? I've never owned a Samsung and I never will. People need to step out of this abusive relationship instead of trying to improve it. You will never be happy with a device you don't own.

Really quick that leads to not being able to buy anything though.

Sony has done a bunch of evil things (deleting paid media, hiding rootkits in music CDs). Apple abuses their monopoly to force using their web browser and extort a 30% cut of all purchases. Every car manufacturer is tracking every car they sell and selling that data. Retailers are tracking store visits using everything from face recognition to MAC addresses on cell phones.

Boycotting can only do so much. We need regulations to protect people and steep fines for violating them.

Re: Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

#106

Post by wolvoleo »

subscribed wrote: post #78
wolvoleo wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every TV does that unfortunately. It's called automatic content recognition but every manufacturer has a different euphemism for it. It's definitely not just Samsung. As bad as this is. The problem is bigger than just them.

Every TV might do this, not every single one does. Buy TVs which allow you to opt out (at least in one case it was several opt-ins, no opt out per SE).

I don't really want to ask for permission to be excused from this vile monitoring. I don't want it to be in there at all. But I'm not aware of any brand which doesn't do this.

Re: Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

#107

Post by wolvoleo »

imoverclocked wrote: post #87
wolvoleo wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every TV does that unfortunately. It's called automatic content recognition but every manufacturer has a different euphemism for it. It's definitely not just Samsung. As bad as this is. The problem is bigger than just them.

I have a projector that I just leave off the network. Do TVs require a network connection now? What happens when they don't have one?

I heard on another forum that the latest Samsungs just don't progress through the setup wizard without internet. And someone noticed they retain WiFi passwords even after a factory reset.

You can still set up a temporary WiFi and just kill it after but it's getting pretty insane now.

Re: Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

#109

Post by jdmarble »

wolvoleo wrote: post #106
subscribed wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every TV might do this, not every single one does. Buy TVs which allow you to opt out (at least in one case it was several opt-ins, no opt out per SE).

I don't really want to ask for permission to be excused from this vile monitoring. I don't want it to be in there at all. But I'm not aware of any brand which doesn't do this.

I’ve got 2 Sceptre “dumb” TVs.

Re: Samsung Health app threatens data deletion if users opt out AI training

#110

Post by anonymars »

akramachamarei wrote: post #103
anonymars wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Find another health app/service with more preferable terms if you don't like it It never ceases to amaze me how many people defend the Darth Vader style of buying a product: "I am altering the deal; pray I don't alter it any further" I assume it must be rooted in the just-world fallacy: "Clearly anyone affected must not have been careful enough or did something else wrong. Since I'm careful with my purchases, negat…

Your analysis reiterates the popular but fallacious motifs. The real issue is that people don't read the contracts they sign, so when they buy something they imagine that it will do all they expect and probably more from the time they buy until it falls apart. Then they're surprised when Samsung does something permitted by the contract. Then they get annoyed because they feel entitled to something that no one agreed…

A contract that says "we can change the terms of this contract at will" (as pretty much all "terms of service" do) is little more than an adhesive charade

Imagine thinking people who bought a device when it didn't say "in order to use the features we advertise, you must let us train our AI on your data" are the ones who are being unreasonable

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