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Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

reuters.com

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Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#101

Post by Hikikomori »

brainwad wrote: post #80
Hikikomori wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Showing your own product like google maps or shopping at the top of each relevant search result is likely over the line, maybe its ok if its down in the results, still high not always number 1. But for example if they're behind a user choice like a click after your search is done, ie click shopping or maps because you want to use googles products in this case, then its likely not over the line. If its still over the…

I don't really think of showing rich shopping results as preferring "Google's product". It's just showing links to merchants in a fancier UI. It's fundamentally still search, linking out to 3rd party websites. FWIW, even what you think should be allowed is banned in Europe. On Google Search in the EU there is no "Shopping" or "Maps" tab.

Did they remove them due to the case they lost in 2017 then? Products is still available, but doesn't work like shopping does which is much more similar to pricerunner.

https://www.google.com/shopping is still available, just no link to it, so about as decoupled as a separate domain?

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#102

Post by dehrmann »

thesdev wrote: post #68
tjwebbnorfolk wrote: post #63

Klarna is a buy-now-pay-later company, right? How do they compete with google?

This case is about a subsidiary of them called Pricerunner, which is a price-comparison platform. https://www.pricerunner.se

I used to work for a Pricerunner competitor. Not Nextag, but they were the most well-known in the US. They're called "comparison shopping engines," and most were names people would barely remember.

These companies got steamrolled by Google because their service wasn't very good. It's all an affiliate marketing play, where they get traffic for keywords through Google organic search (these sides made heavy use of SEO) and Adwords. When you land on the site, everything is an ad, either a merchant product link the merchant pays per click for or less commonly, an affiliate link. Result ranking is tuned between revenue and relevancy.

The problems are it's not really a comparison as much as search results, you're clicking in from a Google SERP to another list of search results, and the results used factors other than relevancy, and the side was designed to encourage click-outs.

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#103

Post by jillesvangurp »

tuwtuwtuwtuw wrote: post #87
Freak_NL wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quite. At least Google delivers some value to society, despite being mostly evil. Klarna is exclusively parasitic, getting people needlessly into debt and pushing a buy now pay later mentality for luxury products.

I wouldn't say Klarna is exclusively parasitic. Where I am located, Klarna is often the absolutely best choice for payments, and I always pay up front.

Same, I use them because my regular bank are a bunch of muppets when it comes to mobile payments. I use Klarna to pay with my phone. It auto debits from the bank account. I've never paid them any interest. Works fine, other companies are available offering similar services. Key for me: works online/offline, sane process for blocking things, works internationally without getting ripped off on exchange rates, etc. I guess they make some money on deferred payments to vendors. Good for them.

You can choose to go into debt with them and they make that really easy. But it's a choice in the end. If you can't be trusted running your own finances, don't get a credit card from any bank.

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#104

Post by carlosjobim »

piva00 wrote: post #30
carlosjobim wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well if the Swedish courts stomp on Google in the name of national interest, maybe the US will stomp on Sweden in the name of national interest. Now consider where Klarna gets the most of their money from.

So no country can ever take action and enforce their local laws because the USA can retaliate? Why have local laws in that case? Better we all just adopt American laws to not have to fear the Americans getting pissy when they diverge...

I replied to a comment arguing that courts should pass judgements according to what is in the national economic interest. That would mean courts following other guidelines than the law.

Protectionism works both ways - as it should. So if Sweden disadvantages American companies in the name of protecting domestic companies like Klarna, then it's completely expected that the US will do the same thing against Swedish companies to protect their domestic companies.

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#105

Post by carlosjobim »

embedding-shape wrote: post #37
carlosjobim wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well if the Swedish courts stomp on Google in the name of national interest, maybe the US will stomp on Sweden in the name of national interest. Now consider where Klarna gets the most of their money from.

> Now consider where Klarna gets the most of their money from. Considering Klarna essentially boils down to a lending service for people who want to buy stuff they aren't able to afford in the moment, I don't think this is the dunk you think it is.

Companies like Klarna are a plague, no disagreement in that.

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#106

Post by Teever »

thayne wrote: post #91
WarmWash wrote: post #53

People aren't going to like this, but taking a page from Apple, Microsoft, Sony (iPhone, Xbox, Playstation), the solution to constant antitrust charges stemming from competitors on your platform....is to kick them off the platform. You can't be anti-competitive if you have no competitors.

That is even more obviously anti-competitive. Not that we've seen any effective enforcement against it...

Right? Like the through line for all of this stuff is limp and ineffective enforcement.

Fines need to start doubling for every time one of these companies reoffend.

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#107

Post by Hikikomori »

YetAnotherNick wrote: post #44
usrnm wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No

Source? The only news I can find about is EU users can uninstall it.

There used to be a browser chooser app, but it was removed many years ago now. Now you can just uninstall edge instead.

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#108

Post by Danox »

thayne wrote: post #91
WarmWash wrote: post #53

People aren't going to like this, but taking a page from Apple, Microsoft, Sony (iPhone, Xbox, Playstation), the solution to constant antitrust charges stemming from competitors on your platform....is to kick them off the platform. You can't be anti-competitive if you have no competitors.

That is even more obviously anti-competitive. Not that we've seen any effective enforcement against it...

Sony, Nintendo never had any pretense. If you want to be on their system, you basically have to go in and have a personal job interview to be on their system and they make no bones about it that it’s their system, and you’re there for as long as they want you there. Originally Apple was going to be a closed system and originally was just gonna have web apps, but a whole bunch of developers beg them to open up a store and a few years later, a few of the big companies were crying because Apple was successful and wanted special treatment.

In reality, how many different apps do you need? Do you need 3 million apps? One can probably get by with 50,000 apps. It would still basically be the same in terms of user experience. Most users wouldn’t even know the difference. The only people crying would be other businesses. who want to latch on.

Note: Sony Nintendo over the years get very helpful people, so-called experts who say they must change the way they do things to conform with everyone else, but they never do. still in business, and still kicking Microsoft’s ass.

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#109

Post by dmurray »

giancarlostoro wrote: post #85
fsuts wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But does that apply to shopping? I have often had a look at Google shopping results but very rarely clicked one. I think when searching for an answer ai assist is often sufficient but not for where you are buying?

> I have often had a look at Google shopping results but very rarely clicked one. Pretty sure that tab is all ads, so its all garbage, in some cases some of the results look like scams.

It worked great for me recently buying running shoes.

I knew what shoes I wanted, there are plenty of no-name merchants selling them, competing on price (last year's model, so not being sold in big name stores). Click through each of them, find one with the right size, colour, delivery prices. Very painless. If some of the merchants are scams, I wouldn't know, my shoes arrived anyway.

Instead of "all ads, so it's all garbage" this is exactly what I wish all advertising could be.

Re: Swedish court says Google is to pay $1.5B to Klarna in antitrust damages

#110

Post by SllX »

exabrial wrote: post #84

The problem is Google/Apple and these people that self-identify as platforms" should probably divest from providing any 1st party services on their "platforms".

No. Platforms are better when the owners of them continue to invest directly in & improve the user experience. Turning them into white label runtimes for apps is something only nerds & bureaucrats with visions of grandeur dream of.
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