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The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

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Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#101

Post by dannersy »

BirAdam wrote: post #72
dannersy wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we ignore the cultural issues with Americans where some places buying an EV is considered "gay" (because that is inheritently negative to them) then we can easily point to the hostile lobbying tactics and government capitulation via bought congressmen. Go look at the historical hostilities Tesla faced when first trying to take off. If I still lived in the US, I'd be hesitant to buy an EV because the infrastructure…

If the US government quit subsidizing oil companies and traditional automakers, there’d be more incentive to make good, affordable EVs, and more incentive for Americans to buy them.

Yes, but keep in mind there is a while world of EV production out there not available to the US for one reason or another that are plenty competitive with the low tier combustion engine cars.

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#102

Post by robocat »

nxm wrote: post #9

Umm not when the adversary is using heavy government subsidies to undercut prices and essentially take over the industry. Look at what’s happening to the European car industry, with more job losses planned by VW just this week

Not like the US isn't doing equivalent shenanigans:

https://archive.ph/9vUNF "Donald Trump is kicking out Chinese firms and keeping their tech"

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#103

Post by piva00 »

WarmWash wrote: post #89
danmaz74 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to this logic, Taiwan should keep the most advanced chips to itself, the EU should keep the most advanced chip lithography machines to itself, etc etc.

I mean, yeah they could. But what they get back for exporting is more than it is worth to them alone. Taiwan has no use for huge amounts of silicon and Europe has no use for SOTA lithography. I don't see how that is the case with the US and leading edge AI. The US has a lot of use for that, and on balance, I cannot think of anything that is more valuable than super intelligent AI. It's basically the end game power fo…

> Countries could try what essentially amounts to unilateral sanctions on the US to try and force sharing, but it's unlikely it would go well.

Many unlikely things happened the past 18 months in geopolitical terms, it was unlikely that Denmark would have to ready troops to send to Greenland to fend off American aggression but here we are.

Whatever was unlikely on the previous world order is up in the air now, no one knows how the USA breaking its alliances will shape the future world in 10-20 years. It turned out that it's also unlikely things will go well with the previous status quo, realignments are bound to happen.

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#104

Post by piva00 »

gonzalohm wrote: post #22
nxm wrote: post #9

Umm not when the adversary is using heavy government subsidies to undercut prices and essentially take over the industry. Look at what’s happening to the European car industry, with more job losses planned by VW just this week

Isn't that the market strategy of silicon valley companies? Sell at a loss, capture the whole market and then inflate prices

It's always been the strategy for VC-funded companies: undercut pricing for as long as possible to achieve market dominance, slowly turn the price knob up to become profitable.

Always funny to read the tirades against subsidies here on HN, sometimes even the same users praising how much more capital exist in SV/USA for risky ventures (compared to the EU and other markets) will also complain about how China is undercutting competition with subsidies, without ever batting an eye to the fact the exuberant privilege the USA holds in capital markets is exactly what makes it possible for private investors to subsidise loss-making ventures for years to decades in the USA until the company becomes profitable.

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#105

Post by rdtsc »

cromka wrote: post #98
rdtsc wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which free-market-loving country doesn't?

EU as a whole? Did you see the number of mutually beneficial trade agreements they signed in past 15 years to promote free trade on either ends?

But that's not a country. And in their case it's also true that policy set up by the structure can go against the interests of individual countries.

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#106

Post by jm4 »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #97
jm4 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the most part, but who is going to get on the highway to charge their car if they weren’t already headed that way? And 50 miles is a long way to go. It’s unreasonable to expect anyone to drive 100 miles to charge (and waste all that range). Just get a gas car at that point.

2/3rds of Americans live in single family homes, more if you include row houses. Some apartments have 120V in their parking spot. None of them have to get on the highway to charge.

How many drivers with their own car live in a single family home? That 2/3 statistic is undoubtedly skewed by minors who don’t drive and live with their parents.

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#107

Post by illiac786 »

mitthrowaway2 wrote: post #78
jgalt212 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And today, Chinese marques are eating everyone's lunch on every metric in the EV sector because the industry is running at a loss, and dumping below cost products on the global markets.

I hear this about every Chinese product from steel to LLMs, but it can't be possible to run every industry at a loss at the same time, especially not for a net-creditor nation. Which Chinese industries are running the surplus that subsidizes the rest?

I hear this for EVs mostly. They do this in sectors where they want to become the monopolist, so they can then raise prices (not really criticism, everyone tries to pull this). I agree with you it’s not possible to do this everywhere at the same time.

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#108

Post by IAmBroom »

BirAdam wrote: post #72
dannersy wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we ignore the cultural issues with Americans where some places buying an EV is considered "gay" (because that is inheritently negative to them) then we can easily point to the hostile lobbying tactics and government capitulation via bought congressmen. Go look at the historical hostilities Tesla faced when first trying to take off. If I still lived in the US, I'd be hesitant to buy an EV because the infrastructure…

If the US government quit subsidizing oil companies and traditional automakers, there’d be more incentive to make good, affordable EVs, and more incentive for Americans to buy them.

If my grandmother had wheels, she would have been a bike.

But instead, here in this reality...

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#109

Post by greenmilk »

We have an entire generation of technologists convinced that you need a monopoly for a business to be viable, so every tech company is either trying to subsidize its way into a monopoly or running a deadweight loss.

Unsurprisingly, the resulting economy in aggregate is non-competitive, as it relies entirely on supply chains from competitive marketplaces.

Re: The US Used to Demand the Best Tech. Now We Ban It

#110

Post by johnea »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #83
johnea wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the jump in EV sales in Europe are primarily driven by environment consciousness. The jump in EV sales this year are primarily driven by seeing what a psycho in the US whitehouse can immediately do to gasoline prices. Gasoline only comes from one source., and is largely delivered around the world by shipping. Electricity is able to be generated by many means, and is available everywhere. I know several…

I think a large part of it is just EV's getting good & cheap. You can get a quite good EV for £15,000 now.

Sorry for the very late reply.

This article was just pubished:

https://www.npr.org/2026/07/09/nx-s1-5872786/iran-war-evs-so...

"China exported more than 2 million electric passenger vehicles between January and May"

Now, with the awesome deal with Iran of a "Big, Beautiful, not-a-nuclear-nonproliferation Treaty" blown out the window, along with the rest of the hot air emitted from our idiot in the oval office, oil prices are going through the roof again.

I am very glad to hear that affordable electric cars are available in England. This is a giant step forward.

I'm not glad for the reason, but I'm also glad that countries around the world are accelerating a transition away from petro based energy.

Here in the US, GM is announcing a new coal powered car, with the slogan: "Bring back the Stanely Steamer".

While all Chinese EVs are banned.

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